[mheyman]

93 octane on a Mustang Dyno with the Killer B headers and full bolt ons will yield about 380. It's 10whp for every psi of boost so the Dom 1.5 drops off efficiency after about 24-25psi so 400whp is quite doable.

Get the 10cm housing, Killer B header makes it spool very nicely, it keeps EGT's down a bit.

Also consider at the very least a full driveline bushing upgrade from motor, transmission mounts, pitch stop etc all the way back to the rear diff. The extra power will need this upgrade or you might start to risk breaking things.

What are you trying to say here?

10whp/psi is linear.
"Dom 1.5 drops off efficiency after about 24-25psi" is not linear

Best I can come up with is that a 1.5XT could do 400 at over 40psi since 10whp/psi and add more for the loss in efficiency.

Nah. that doesn't work at all. 360 is normally at something near 22psi no?

It's not linear, it's just an approximation. 377 @ 21.6psi is quite possible on a heartbreaker dyno using good ELH like the Killer B. There are another 4psi there so exceeding 400whp especially with a good set of ELH like the Killer B and a moderately aggressive tune is quite possible. PM me with your email.

So:

y = mx+b or whp = 10*PSI whp/psi + C

where
Y = whp = 377
m = whp/psi = 10
b = C = 161 (in units of whp)

10wph/psi*(21.6+4)psi + 161whp = 417whp

 

[uschearak]

So:

y = mx+b or whp = 10*PSI whp/psi + C

where
Y = whp = 377
m = whp/psi = 10
b = C = 161 (in units of whp)

10wph/psi*(21.6+4)psi + 161whp = 417whp

It's not a linear graph silly. It's an asymptotic graph. The more psi you push, the less gains per psi you will make.

I honestly do not think a Dom 1.5 can make 400whp on a moderate dyno safely. I think if you push 24-25 psi on pump 93, you will be knocking like crazy. 93 just doesn't have the octane to safely and reliably reach those numbers with the cfms of the dom1.5. If your goal is to go to the limits on a Dom 1.5, then go e85.

And honestly if spooling 500rpms later isn't a huge deal breaker for you, spend the extra $600-$800 and go rotated. That way you're set up for pushing more power later, and you can easily tune to 400whp if that's what you're after. Honestly guys, crunch the numbers, rotating is not that much more expensive, and will give you a ton more headroom.

I never understood stock location tmic mods.

 

[mheyman]

It's not a linear graph silly. It's an asymptotic graph. The more psi you push, the less gains per psi you will make.



I honestly do not think a Dom 1.5 can make 400whp on a moderate dyno safely. I think if you push 24-25 psi on pump 93, you will be knocking like crazy. 93 just doesn't have the octane to safely and reliably reach those numbers with the cfms of the dom1.5. If your goal is to go to the limits on a Dom 1.5, then go e85.



And honestly if spooling 500rpms later isn't a huge deal breaker for you, spend the extra $600-$800 and go rotated. That way you're set up for pushing more power later, and you can easily tune to 400whp if that's what you're after. Honestly guys, crunch the numbers, rotating is not that much more expensive, and will give you a ton more headroom.



I never understood stock location tmic mods.

1) i was just putting math to claims erlier in this thread where it was posted 10whp/psi. I said no then. More information was posted and i just provided the associated math.

2) Generally telling people to go E85 is a silly suggestion. It simply isn't available everywhere. Its not available where i commute, but even if it were id need separate maps to travel.

3) I just choose not to go rotated mostly due to cost. The switch from stock location 1.5 to rotated GTX3071 top mount was over$2500. The additional work and parts i wanted to go with that build were starting to look like an additional $3K. So i was looking at over $5K to properly complete a rotated setup that would have added close to 100whp.

A compatible DP would cost the $500 you state let alone all that nice V/band plumbing. The turbo upgrade would be about that much too.

4) with over 185K on my car i had no interest in setting the car up for more power later - especially when i was already over budget for the near future. It'll be years and the car at over 250k before i reconsider.

 

[8cd03gro]

1) i was just putting math to claims erlier in this thread where it was posted 10whp/psi. I said no then. More information was posted and i just provided the associated math.

2) Generally telling people to go E85 is a silly suggestion. It simply isn't available everywhere. Its not available where i commute, but even if it were id need separate maps to travel.

3) I just choose not to go rotated mostly due to cost. The switch from stock location 1.5 to rotated GTX3071 top mount was over$2500. The additional work and parts i wanted to go with that build were starting to look like an additional $3K. So i was looking at over $5K to properly complete a rotated setup that would have added close to 100whp.

A compatible DP would cost the $500 you state let alone all that nice V/band plumbing. The turbo upgrade would be about that much too.

4) with over 185K on my car i had no interest in setting the car up for more power later - especially when i was already over budget for the near future. It'll be years and the car at over 250k before i reconsider.

$3k on top of a 1.5 setup to go rotated? No way. You're getting ripped off somewhere. You can hack your current downpipe at the bend and rotate just the front portion, then run an adapter for the hot-side inlet. If it costs you more than $1,200 for the plumbing you're getting ripped off. Turbo pricing is a wash if you go GTX, cheaper if you go GT. My rotated setup ended up about 600-700 more than a stock location 30r setup with equivalent components.

 

[mheyman]

$3k on top of a 1.5 setup to go rotated? No way. You're getting ripped off somewhere. You can hack your current downpipe at the bend and rotate just the front portion, then run an adapter for the hot-side inlet. If it costs you more than $1,200 for the plumbing you're getting ripped off. Turbo pricing is a wash if you go GTX, cheaper if you go GT. My rotated setup ended up about 600-700 more than a stock location 30r setup with equivalent components.

Even here you are saying $1200 just for plumbing. What, you got a shop that subtracts as you add stuff to get down to your former $700 estimate? Yeah.

Haven't been under my car yet, but after seeing under the hood and driving, I'll be surprised and disappointed to find anything hacked. Thats a compliment to the shop although expected from their reputation

As for modifying my DP my in fully supported rotated build would have meant a modding each end and in the middle. No sense in the that and I don't even have to ask the shop if they would. It would be cheaper to use their rotated DP which comes with their "kit". They wouldn't even bother with your single ended mod.

 

[8cd03gro]

Even here you are saying $1200 just for plumbing. What, you got a shop that subtracts as you add stuff to get down to your former $700 estimate? Yeah.

The T3 GT3076R was $300 cheaper than a Dom 1.5 ($500 cheaper than any comparable flow/spool stock location turbo from Blouch) and my intake consists of a 4" aluminum tube and cone filter that together cost a whopping $50 (no need to purchase an inlet and airbox/intake) which is easily going to save another $200++ compared to stock location. All said and done it cost me about $700 more than a stock location 30r setup would have, maybe $800 if you include the speed density swap. The difference becomes even less compared to stock location turbos that will perform similarly.

Haven't been under my car yet, but after seeing under the hood and driving, I'll be surprised and disappointed to find anything hacked. Thats a compliment to the shop although expected from their reputation

What? Is there something wrong with cutting and welding? Might want to have a sit down with some of the best performance shops in the world and tell them how wrong they're going about their business.

As for modifying my DP my in fully supported rotated build would have meant a modding each end and in the middle. No sense in the that and I don't even have to ask the shop if they would. It would be cheaper to use their rotated DP which comes with their "kit". They wouldn't even bother with your single ended mod.

Why would you have to modify each end? You're still going to connect to the catback/mid-pipe in the exact same manner and location. The back half of the downpipe, after the bend, doesn't need to change at all. If they have a rotated setup you don't really need to custom fab, but based on your price estimates, their rotated setup sounds very expensive.

 

[Josh x]

How would a 1.5xtr compare to a stock location ATP gt3071r .82 housing?
I believe both flow at 49lbs..

 

[mheyman]

The T3 GT3076R was $300 cheaper than a Dom 1.5 ($500 cheaper than any comparable flow/spool stock location turbo from Blouch) and my intake consists of a 4" aluminum tube and cone filter that together cost a whopping $50 (no need to purchase an inlet and airbox/intake) which is easily going to save another $200++ compared to stock location. All said and done it cost me about $700 more than a stock location 30r setup would have, maybe $800 if you include the speed density swap. The difference becomes even less compared to stock location turbos that will perform similarly.

I might have remember $500 off, perhaps improperly rounding. So $2500 in my case.
That did include a DP & GTX Turbo. I didn't want to do this without other changes that would have been a minimum of $1500 above the $2500. I decided no before I got a closer higher estimate that included more parts that I left out. This would have been a bigger and upgraded build. It's what I would have called fully supported. For instance, I might have had to upgrade the fuel pump - again.

Other than that All I am going to say is that Perrin Full Race and tuner kits are both $2000 alone. No turbo.

 

[valvefloat]

how many dyno graphs have been posted or linked to ? lol

here's one ...2011 STi Dom1.5+meth MPS protune 405/427

still running OE short block at 42+K miles...consistent oil consumption, same as day one...~<1L per OCI...

i've had a built block in my closet for nearly three effin years..LOL...i fell for the "burnt ringland"

hysteria on the 08+ GR...now watch i'll blow my sh*t up next week...

 

[8cd03gro]

I might have remember $500 off, perhaps improperly rounding. So $2500 in my case.
That did include a DP & GTX Turbo. I didn't want to do this without other changes that would have been a minimum of $1500 above the $2500. I decided no before I got a closer higher estimate that included more parts that I left out. This would have been a bigger and upgraded build. It's what I would have called fully supported. For instance, I might have had to upgrade the fuel pump - again.

Right, I run a Radium surge tank with a 450lph inside. You could easily do an in-tank though, if you're no tracking the car hard and worried about slosh. The need for a larger pump isn't a result of going rotated though, it's a result of more power.

Other than that All I am going to say is that Perrin Full Race and tuner kits are both $2000 alone. No turbo.

Right, but the argument is that if you go rotated from the get-go it isn't that much more expensive. The Perrin rotated kit (which I would recommend against anyway) includes up-pipe, downpipe, intake, etc. So if you compare to their non-rotated stuff:

Up-pipe - $250
Intake - $215 (+ $270 if you get their inlet, which you'll want for an upgraded turbo)
Downpipe - $350 (I don't think they offer this anymore, but that's the typical price)

You're already over $1,000 and you're going to pay at least $250 more for an equivalent stock location turbo vs rotated, so again you're going to save yourself less than a grand.

If you already have all the non-rotated supporting mods there's less incentive and more cost to go rotated, but even then it's not THAT much more expensive. Assuming similar power levels and supporting mods of course. There are cheaper ways than going with one of the kits too, I am using a stock location up-pipe still, for example. The adapter was $125.

In the end everyone has to do what makes sense for them, it is just unfortunate when everyone assumes going rotated will cost them an arm and a leg more when in reality, if you do it right, it won't cost much more for an equivalent rotated setup that gives you a lot more potential down the road.

 

[pearson222]

I am wondering what spool characteristics other Dom 1.5 owners are experiencing.

I am running a built bottom end, Killer B headers, EWG, on e85 and am seeing 24psi @ 4.7k in 3rd gear. I feel like I should be spooling quite a bit sooner than that and am wondering if this is typical or unique to my setup.

 

[Leemanfor]

thats super laggy for your mods. you should be seeing 24 psi by 4000-4200 RPMs at least

 

[IronmanSTI17]

This one should get a couple people going. 2017 STI bone stock baseline of 250whp/248wtq on this dyno. Dom 1.5xtr 10cm 3” inlet with a fully built 2mm long rod motor, gsc valve train, bc272 cams, also ported/polished. E70 511whp/436wtq @7000RPMS and on 93 octane 461whp/395wtq. This is all at 24psi target boost. I was in disbelief too.

 

[Leemanfor]

This one should get a couple people going. 2017 STI bone stock baseline of 250whp/248wtq on this dyno. Dom 1.5xtr 10cm 3” inlet with a fully built 2mm long rod motor, gsc valve train, bc272 cams, also ported/polished. E70 511whp/436wtq @7000RPMS and on 93 octane 461whp/395wtq. This is all at 24psi target boost. I was in disbelief too.

Happy dyno.

 

[8cd03gro]

This one should get a couple people going. 2017 STI bone stock baseline of 250whp/248wtq on this dyno. Dom 1.5xtr 10cm 3” inlet with a fully built 2mm long rod motor, gsc valve train, bc272 cams, also ported/polished. E70 511whp/436wtq @7000RPMS and on 93 octane 461whp/395wtq. This is all at 24psi target boost. I was in disbelief too.

Lol 460whp on 91? That's a 35R number. Seems far too high for a 1.5.

 

[IronmanSTI17]

460 on 93, I know that it’s not a huge difference in octane. I’m kinda still in disbelief too but it’s pretty dam fast. I wanna get it on a dynojet to see what it makes. Prior it made 350whp/400wtq on E85 (same dyno) and it would pull pretty hard against stock Focus RSs and 340is. That’s the only reference I have to guesstimate how accurate those numbers were. It was built and tuned by BrenTuning. Once again 250whp/248 wtq baseline.

 

[mindwolf]

very satisfied with 390 on 93 octane and very good supporting mods...

 

[mheyman]

1.5XTR

350+ - up to nearing 400 on 93.

Spool should be similar to stock.

I think drive the fastest 350+ (meaning not really near 400) there ever was. Seriously.
It does have a very conservatively tuned 1.5XTR.
It's not really about what number you can puff up your chest with whether its boost or torque or HP. At least not if you actually drive the car.

 

[8cd03gro]

460 on 93, I know that it’s not a huge difference in octane. I’m kinda still in disbelief too but it’s pretty dam fast. I wanna get it on a dynojet to see what it makes. Prior it made 350whp/400wtq on E85 (same dyno) and it would pull pretty hard against stock Focus RSs and 340is. That’s the only reference I have to guesstimate how accurate those numbers were. It was built and tuned by BrenTuning. Once again 250whp/248 wtq baseline.

350whp stock turbo?

 

[IronmanSTI17]

Yes, 353whp/400wtq (E85) on the stock VF48 turbo prior. On 93 it would make 325whp/359wtq. This was also on the prior stock block/rotating assembly, and heads. If you where wondering the old motor developed a rod knock at 27k miles. It had every bolt on and supporting mod you could buy besides TGV deletes and turbo inlet. For an exhaust manifold it’s running a killer b ELH.