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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Newly updated, 03/03/10:
- I've again updated the spreadsheets to account for new or changed pricing, and to account for new kits that are now offered.

- Unfortunately, I think Full-Race was painted in an expensive light when they first came on the Subaru scene because of their presumed "high" pricing. However, the cattle on the forums didn't delve deeper into their pricing and realize that it included so much more than the regular, mediocre run of the mill kits on the market.

- Now, Full-Race has dropped their pricing. :tup: On top of that, as people will see below, for what you get (twinscroll, FR's manifold and UP, twin Tial 38mm MV-S WG's), for the bit extra that FR costs over the cheap kits (P&L, Perrin, Crawford) and the more well known kits (APS, UR, AMS) it's foolish IMO not to save a bit more and get the quality.

- I separated the 40R kits from the 35R kits. You can draw your own conclusions, but the UR singlescroll 40R "kit" is the biggest joke I've seen. I'm not sure if they made a mistake, but I'll give them the benefit of the doubt and say that they've mistakenly screwed up either the price, or what's offered at the price. Their twinscroll offering is expensive as well, and not near the quality (IMO) that Full-Race is.

- One last note: I didn't bother updating the small turbo kit pricing. It wasn't worth the time or effort. The conclusion of that spreadsheet still stands - starting from scratch, the price difference between a stock location turbo and a rotated setup is negligible. The various turbos are all priced in the same region (Blouch's new stuff, FP's stuff, ATP stuff...) so adjust accordingly.

Disclaimers:
1) What is below is MSRP website pricing. Everything is assuming you purchase it brand new from a vendor without getting a deal.

2) My bottom line for each turbo kit is an estimation. That isn't the final number. Discounts and sales will lower the cost, but the cost of tuning, miscellaneous costs, and unlisted hardware/tuning/hourly fees etc are
not exact so that could and will raise the price.
- Sales, specials, shipping, tax etc is not factored in.
- Labour costs are an estimate, but some people would do it themselves, and others would rather have a shop do it. Add that cost in if it applies to you.

3) Each person will choose different parts manufacturers for things like intakes, intercoolers, BOV's, so I've taken a rough estimate of each part cost favoring towards the higher end products (eBay buyers will save a lot more than the prices I listed).

4) For the big turbo builds, top end motor work 'should' be done as well, but it's not a necessity. If applicable, add in the cost of cams, new valves, springs, retainers, head work, all block hardware etc, and labour to the cost (roughly $5,000-8,000 w/ install)








Things of note:
1) Stock mount turbos come in, on average, only around $715 cheaper than rotated mount kits, BUT add in the cost of an EWG setup, and the price difference in negligible. Therefore, the price difference between rotated mount turbos and stock mount turbos after adding everything is moot. It's a matter of preference and how much you want to gain from the setup.
- The reason most people believe staying stock mount is cheaper is because most people usually buy a TBE, intake and EM first. So, they look at having to buy a rotated DP and intake again and that adds to the cost.

2) I added in an
estimated labour cost of 15 hours @ $90. That's an estimate so it could be a lot more or a lot less depending on how complicated the build is and if there are any problems.
I am not affiliated with any company. I made these spreadsheets on my own time while I was planning my build a couple of years ago, and have periodically updated them.

Hope this helps you guys spend your money wisely :)
 

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Re: Planning a big turbo build? This is roughly how much it's going to cost you...

Man, I try to never think of the cost of this stuff. I may have to add you to by block list now ;)
 

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Re: Planning a big turbo build? This is roughly how much it's going to cost you...

Man that is a great write up/spread sheet. You have also discouraged me from ever upgrading my turbo. My wallet said thank you :D
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Re: Planning a big turbo build? This is roughly how much it's going to cost you...

^Yeah guys, crazy eh? Just pure power modifications.

This is mainly for big turbo builds though. The word on the street is that for 30R sized turbos - GT52, Dom II, Dom III, FP Green, APS SR56 - those 52-56lb/min turbos don't really require a built bottom end if you have a good tune. It's obviously still a good idea since it will be on the edge.

What I found interesting was how close Full-Race was price-wise to UR when all was said and done, and how APS was so much more expensive. Personally, I'd never, ever consider the Perrin kit, but it is a popular name out there so I figured I should include it.

ps. I was pretty conservative with the built block $$ :D
 

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Re: Planning a big turbo build? This is roughly how much it's going to cost you...

you should really include a tbe price on all the kits as there is no way youd want to run the stock set up on any of these
 

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Discussion Starter #9 (Edited)
Re: Planning a big turbo build? This is roughly how much it's going to cost you...

for 3500 range, you are getting only forged rods and pistons.

Would big turbo build require a sleeved block? Not sure how strong the stock sleeves are...
Probably require new sleeves as well. That's bumps things up a bit too... but some might stick with just rods and pistons so I guess that's another thing to factor in on an individual build.

you should really include a tbe price on all the kits as there is no way youd want to run the stock set up on any of these
Well, I did for the APS listing, but the others all include a DP. So really, it'd be adding in a CB of at least a 3" diameter.
Factor in another $500-800?

edit: I added in a CBE for $600. This is getting more painful by the second ;)
 

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Re: Planning a big turbo build? This is roughly how much it's going to cost you...

Thanks for putting this together.

You must be either an accountant or an engineer. :lol:
 

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Re: Planning a big turbo build? This is roughly how much it's going to cost you...

i completely appreciate the effort and i'm sure the spreadsheet is on the money. to that i would add that, once you start with any of these turbo kits, you will need to spend a lot more money on suspension, brakes, and everything else, assuming you have the smarts to make sure the rest of the car can keep up with all the power. you can start doubling or tripling what you see listed here.
 

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Re: Planning a big turbo build? This is roughly how much it's going to cost you...

Yes Bruce, we know... we know... :lol:
 

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Re: Planning a big turbo build? This is roughly how much it's going to cost you...

matt i wish you would of listed a 30r (gt53, blouch) sized setup in comparison to the rotate mount kits........right now im trying to decide if i should go rotate mount VS. standard mount....personally i know i'd never go 35r, but im contemplating if i should go with a gt52 as you have or just wait for a 30r rotate down the road.....can you add a column into your raw azz spread sheet with rotate mount 30r and stock mount gt52? pretty please with sugar on top?

or can you make another spread sheet compairing rotate mount 30r such as full race compaired to a aps/gt52 setup.....basically what you have right now......
 

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Discussion Starter #15
Re: Planning a big turbo build? This is roughly how much it's going to cost you...

Thanks for putting this together.

You must be either an accountant or an engineer. :lol:
Lol, neither. But I love a good damn spreadsheet :lol:

i completely appreciate the effort and i'm sure the spreadsheet is on the money. to that i would add that, once you start with any of these turbo kits, you will need to spend a lot more money on suspension, brakes, and everything else, assuming you have the smarts to make sure the rest of the car can keep up with all the power. you can start doubling or tripling what you see listed here.
Absolutely. I was debating throwing that in there, but there are too many variables.
I'd guess at another $2,500 for a very capable suspension setup, another $500-1000 for brakes, another $500-1000 for a water/meth injection system, tires, wheels.... the list goes on and on.
My guess is that a full-out modded STI (that's still sane, ie. not your car) is probably looking at $15-40k in parts and labour.

You have to 2 exhaust's listed on the APS column (TBE and CBE).
Thanks - fixed.

matt i wish you would of listed a 30r (gt53, blouch) sized setup in comparison to the rotate mount kits........right now im trying to decide if i should go rotate mount VS. standard mount....personally i know i'd never go 35r, but im contemplating if i should go with a gt52 as you have or just wait for a 30r rotate down the road.....can you add a column into your raw azz spread sheet with rotate mount 30r and stock mount gt52? pretty please with sugar on top?

or can you make another spread sheet compairing rotate mount 30r such as full race compaired to a aps/gt52 setup.....basically what you have right now......
I added a new spreadsheet. It's not as clear cut as the first since there are so many options for intakes, exhausts, EM, but I gave you a rough estimate

I think the new spreadsheet clearly shows that the difference in cost of going rotated or stock is negligible.

Interesting stuff ;)
 

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Re: Planning a big turbo build? This is roughly how much it's going to cost you...

Probably require new sleeves as well. That's bumps things up a bit too... but some might stick with just rods and pistons so I guess that's another thing to factor in on an individual build.


Well, I did for the APS listing, but the others all include a DP. So really, it'd be adding in a CB of at least a 3" diameter.
Factor in another $500-800?

edit: I added in a CBE for $600. This is getting more painful by the second ;)
The cost of my recent build up (rotated 30r +FMIC+exhaust) was in the $15,000 range with installs and tuning. One factor to consider is upgradability. chances are this won't be the last turbo you'll buy. How easy will it be with each respective kit to add another bigger turbo later?
 

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Re: Planning a turbo build? This is the price breakdown. Full-Race, APS, UR, Perrin,

Nice job (and I mean that) but once again there is the hidden "biggie" missing: labor. I know you intentionally left it out, but to anyone who hasn't been down this road it could be very misleading. The only reason I keep harping on this is simple: it bites guys in the ass every time. Heh, I had it in my spreadsheet and it still bit me hard. At $70-90/hour, it adds up very, very quickly.

One more point: you're gonna need a different clutch with a GT35R...a GT30R, and you can get away with the stocker for a while, but not with a GT35R.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Re: Planning a turbo build? This is the price breakdown. Full-Race, APS, UR, Perrin,

^Good point. I wasn't going to add in labour, but it is worthwhile when trying to get a valid estimate for total cost.

So, I added in labour for both sheets, but not a clutch. That's related, but I still think it's separate enough (and people should know that anyway) to be omitted.
 

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Re: Planning a big turbo build? This is roughly how much it's going to cost you...

The cost of my recent build up (rotated 30r +FMIC+exhaust) was in the $15,000 range with installs and tuning. One factor to consider is upgradability. chances are this won't be the last turbo you'll buy. How easy will it be with each respective kit to add another bigger turbo later?
How is that? Say 6k for the top of the line 30R kit, $1500 for a bad ass fmic, $1600 for a titanium cbe, and then you had 6k in labor and tuning? Including a Hydra, that is still a TON of money on tuning and install costs. Oh well, can we hear about your setup? I am intrigued.

P.S.
GREAT SPREADSHEETS. It is quite depressing to see how much our happiness costs.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Re: Planning a turbo build? This is the price breakdown. Full-Race, APS, UR, Perrin,

^If he doesn't mind me answering for him, Mr. Striker had a lot of motor issues (nothing serious) that needed to be sorted out - WRX parts needed to be replaced with STI parts, fuel lines, injectors, custom fabricating to get stuff to work... there was a serious overhaul involved that required a lot of labour to get him rolling.

PS. thanks.
 
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