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Yeah, I would definatly agree with this article. I can't hardly order a burger from Mc. D's back in my home town because nobody there speaks english, and thats not exaggertating!!!
 

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I agree with it's effects on IT. Alot of my friends in IT can't find work because of some guy named Kerpal working for like $3 per hour in India. :mad: I am lucky that I have got a job, and it's IT, and I do believe it would be tough to outsource it.

We should be taking care of our own first. I am sorry for being ethnocentric, but if you are American (any ethnicity, but American citizen), you should have a job here over somebody else that they bring in on a H1B. PERIOD. Until our unemployment rate starts to go down we should stop all H1B's, and find some way to reduce outsourcing, especially in IT. Maybe we could use some homeland security arguments for it...

Plus, they are exploiting these workers overseas anyway, and the H1B's that they bring here which is not fair to them.

It's a mess, and we need to deal with it now as a country before we cause long-term bad effects to our economy and in turn the rest of the worlds..
 

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how much of this is a consequence of being a capitalist system? corporations are here to make money. who can blame them, especially since "we" (investors) are the ones demanding they make us rich.

regarding illegals displacing america teens in jobs, my sense is that america teens aren't lining up to fill jobs. e.g., the pool company our community used last year had to import lifeguards from europe because american teens were not applying in sufficient quantities. (and frankly, the latvians and russians we had were fantastic compared to the spoiled brat aloof americans teens we had two years ago.)

what i wished the article had included, if not a candidate solution, was some speculation of what might happen to the economy if these abuses were stopped today: no illegals; no h1-b abuses; no outsourcing. anyone here care to speculate?

//speculation-mode -on

seems to me that almost immediately, prices for everything (e.g. groceries, lawn care, house cleaning, etc.) would increase and corporate profits would plummet; an undesireable *combination* of effects. it seems like that alone could bring on a recession. the consequences could be much worse if it were to happen *during* a recession.
 

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i could see where prices would increase a bit but i don't think profits would necessarily plummet, the increase in american workforce, and americans are consumers, would offset the loss of sales due to increase in price.
 

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but i don't think profits would necessarily plummet
Right, but one thing to consider is a standard of living we all enjoy. This means getting quality goods and bargain prices, and thus we would effectively outsource on our own. Of course this is speculation on my part..

I certainly don't like it and I always check to see where the good I buy are made. Doesn't necessarily mean I stop if it says "Made in China," but I try my best to support locally owned shops and products and certainly buy US products whenever I can, especially if I know that the products are made by Americans and not "illegal alien Americans."
 

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Trailer queen?!

chawklit said:
i could see where prices would increase a bit but i don't think profits would necessarily plummet, the increase in american workforce, and americans are consumers, would offset the loss of sales due to increase in price.
//simple-minded economist-mode -on

according to the article, corporates are attracted to foreigners because they will accept lower wages than americans. therefore, in order to increase the american workforce, corporations will either have to pay higher wages, or the mindset of the american worker will have to change to accept lower wages. both seem to have incredible inertia; they're not gonna change overnight. so if wages are lower and products are more expensive, people have less expendable dollars and consumption decreases.

in the current recession, where americans (especially IT) have accepted the reality that the high-paying jobs of yesterday no longer exist and hence are willing to accept substantially lower salaries, then perhaps corporations can continue to keep pay low. however, foreigners will always be inclined to accept even lower pay because, like the article says, an implicit fringe benefit of their employment is a thing we take for granted: living and working in the US.
 

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so basically what we need to do to solve this is improve the economy of every other country to where immigrants would cease coming over here to look for work or we need to isolate ourselves from foreign immigration in order to stop illegal immigrants from getting jobs and draining money from benefits programs. in my mind, either will be near impossible to do.
 

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We do have that new Secretary of Home Land Security office starting up, that hopfully will help with our immigration problem somewhat. Also, everyone has to remember how thrifty Americans can be, they might bitch about how we're losing all of our jobs to illegal aliens, but when it comes time to support ourselves by buying stuff made in the U.S.A. they'll usually go for the item thats made in China because its a buck cheaper, I see it happen a lot, esspecially with my parents. I also think that if the illegal alien problem is solved, not only will the jobs come back to Americans, but after a couple generations of people being **born and raised** in the U.S. rather then half the country being illegal aliens, patriotism will get a huge boost causing companies to stay in America because they want to, not because its cheaper or more efficiant(not that this will ever be the case).....
 

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i don't care what country the stuff i buy comes from. basically if china makes a better product X than the US does, and their prices are about equal then.....i'm going to buy the product from china. that's capitalism at work there (even though china is communist :-? )
 

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chawklit said:
i don't care what country the stuff i buy comes from. basically if china makes a better product X than the US does, and their prices are about equal then.....i'm going to buy the product from china. that's capitalism at work there (even though china is communist :-? )
Exactly. If it was any other way, what are we all doing on this site? Here we are talking about patriotism and buying American products, and we've clamored for years and are finally receiving the car of our dreams... and it's from Japan.

If the Americans could make a car like this, with the same reliability and quality and performance, I would have no problem buying American. But the fact is, no American car company is close. I've lost faith in the Big 3 building anything remotely exciting for under $40k. Maybe the exception is the new Cobra, but hey that's still a Ford.

If Dodge builds the Razor, however, I will be inclined to buy it, IF the new 2.4L turbo proves itself to not fall apart.
 

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chawklit said:
in my mind, either will be near impossible to do.
true. which is why perhaps we should do a little of both. however, there will always be complaints about the gov't giving money to countries (where 25% of the people live in poverty and are subjected to all forms of disease) when maybe 0.1% of americans are living at the same level. (the numbers are fabricated, but i wouldn't be surprised if the really ones are on the same order.) fortunately, brighter minds than mine are responsible for addressing these problems.
 

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I agree with chawklit and Agent Chobos...but I try to see and do every little part. If, for some reason there are two things I'm looking at buying and one is made in China and the other in the States then I am going to try to buy from the US first. Of course cars are pretty much exempt from this ideal...US cars makers have lost my confidence.
 
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