IW STi Forum banner

81 - 100 of 1228 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
268 Posts
Re: Tofu delivery Special (Porting a set of stock headers)

Fuji,

Found your build log on here finally. Still happy to see it progressing.

Let me know if you want any more thoughts/ideas on the car PC as well.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,931 Posts
Discussion Starter #82
Wirelessly posted

Heide264 said:
Fuji,

Found your build log on here finally. Still happy to see it progressing.

Let me know if you want any more thoughts/ideas on the car PC as well.
Glad you found it and thanks. The list on post two is mostly correct. The concept of using the Cobb ap is out the window, as the interface currently used by access race will not display what I want without making a whole other program. And I'm not a programmer. The route most likely to be taken at this point is using the tactrix cable. software mods would be much easier if I go to the source of the previously mentioned software for gauge display. However, I like the overlay and real-time flash capability of the ap because you can modify the maps with the car on. This would allow the mode selector in the center console to function as more than a simple throttle response selector. The good idea fairy might be going out of control on this concept, but eventually I would like that knob to change maps and even the suspension. This could allow me to have the intelligent mode as a pure efficiency map, the sport mode as an agressive street map, and a full race map on sport#. Corresponging suspenion settings would mak that switch change the entire behavior/attitude of the car.

Of course all of this is still just a concept and a few other items such as a variable vane turbo would make it even more impressive. The only main concern I have is ensuring the interface will be easy. I'm not wanting to re-invent the wheel with this.

Work is going to drag on way too long today... with atleast 4 hours of extra time at work that could be used on finishing the headers. Tonight might not be the night for this.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
268 Posts
Re: Tofu delivery Special (Porting a set of stock headers)

Still have to look back at your post, but I'm sure hardware will not be your big issue.

EDIT: Looked, and from what I can tell looks good, if not better than needed. I like the idea of a solid state drive, but I remember you saying raid somewhere along the line to help speed up boot. To my understanding, raid does nothing but maintain a constant copy of your hard drive for backup reasons. It is more useful on servers. The solid state drive will help start up time. You might want to look into a normal (cheap) second hard drive that is larger for music storage.

I would not really mess with the knob personally. I was just debating about the on the fly subject.

The 32 bit ECUs are good for 10k flashes theoretically... Which is a whole lot. As long as you have a reliable car PC and tactrix connection, you should be fine to just pull over and flash another saved map if you want. You might want to get some more opinions on that before quoting me, however.

The car PC could do a lot of pretty cool stuff if you can interface different sensors. Think about throwing some accelerometers on for example. Would make for some interesting performance logs, and be more accurate than a GPS based log. Mostly eye candy though. Could also interface with all digital gauges I assume. Not positive.

I'd be tied up in a knot about actually putting it in. Hard to get a scope of what you want it to do in stone I am sure. I would draw the line at having the touch screen interface with flashing/logging at bare minimum. Added on, I would have a wifi card in it to grab internet off your phone for internet radio.

As far as audio quality goes, I am not sure how the quality compares to aftermarket head units. You may be best off getting an aftermarket single DIN head unit or a sound processing unit to deal with the audio. Just pass the signal to that, and control it from the CarPC.

...Sorry to add to the good idea fairy or to mess up its flight path even more. I have been debating doing the same thing for a very long time, but it is clearly not worth it in my current POS 98 Safari van I'm driving until February-ish, haha.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,931 Posts
Discussion Starter #84
Re: Tofu delivery Special (Porting a set of stock headers)

First up, an update on the headers. I got home 2 hours earlier than I thought I would last night, so I set to working on them. 5 hours later all the internal pnp work was done and the 3 lbs of metal shavings were sweeped off my garage floor. The only work I have left on the headers is sandng the flanges until smooth and removing the external rust. Overall, the major work is complete, and I'll take some pictures tonight before and after the finishing touches.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,931 Posts
Discussion Starter #85
Wirelessly posted

Heide264 said:
Still have to look back at your post, but I'm sure hardware will not be your big issue.

EDIT: Looked, and from what I can tell looks good, if not better than needed. I like the idea of a solid state drive, but I remember you saying raid somewhere along the line to help speed up boot. To my understanding, raid does nothing but maintain a constant copy of your hard drive for backup reasons. It is more useful on servers. The solid state drive will help start up time. You might want to look into a normal (cheap) second hard drive that is larger for music storage.

I would not really mess with the knob personally. I was just debating about the on the fly subject.

The 32 bit ECUs are good for 10k flashes theoretically... Which is a whole lot. As long as you have a reliable car PC and tactrix connection, you should be fine to just pull over and flash another saved map if you want. You might want to get some more opinions on that before quoting me, however.

The car PC could do a lot of pretty cool stuff if you can interface different sensors. Think about throwing some accelerometers on for example. Would make for some interesting performance logs, and be more accurate than a GPS based log. Mostly eye candy though. Could also interface with all digital gauges I assume. Not positive.

I'd be tied up in a knot about actually putting it in. Hard to get a scope of what you want it to do in stone I am sure. I would draw the line at having the touch screen interface with flashing/logging at bare minimum. Added on, I would have a wifi card in it to grab internet off your phone for internet radio.

As far as audio quality goes, I am not sure how the quality compares to aftermarket head units. You may be best off getting an aftermarket single DIN head unit or a sound processing unit to deal with the audio. Just pass the signal to that, and control it from the CarPC.

...Sorry to add to the good idea fairy or to mess up its flight path even more. I have been debating doing the same thing for a very long time, but it is clearly not worth it in my current POS 98 Safari van I'm driving until February-ish, haha.
The list on post two is out of date and when I get home, I'll try to get it more up to date.
- Mass storage will be on a laptop HD.
- check out the storage articles on tweaktown. There's an older article where they did a raid configuration of 4 SSD that was pretty much the ultimate solution for read/write
- I haven't found a decent accelerometer, the one on the carmp3.com store has been sold out for months.
- wireless is a no-go. I'm trying to reduce program overhead and Internet access will require me to have anti-virus software, which usually is a resource hog
- I know the current setup is a bit overkill, but I want a system that will be relatively quick and good for years to come. I a limited by form factor becuase I want to try to fit the entire pc into the dash. OEM like looks is a huge part of my build. Atleast while the unit is off that is. That makes it very difficut to use a double din unit for audio. I haven't seen any clear analysis of sound quality as output by a sound card, but from what I've read, tuning the sound quality of a computer based system is relatively easy because it can be almost automated by some of the programs out there.

I appreciate the input, I've been trying to have discussions about this, but after my thread on car mp3.com pretty much died, I gave up on having an intelligent discussion about my options.
Right now I've been looking at the core i3 becuase the board and CPU aren't that much more than an atom setup, retain the small form factor, use only slightly more power, and use ddr3. When you look at the benefits and the price of the setup, along with the expandability, it seems wise to get instead of a smalle crappier processor.
Until I get a clear motherboard choice, the other options are on standby. I'm sure you know this, but for all the non-geeks reading this, the motherboard is the most important piece of any setup. The motherboard you choose limits what you can do with a system and how far you can take it.
I eventually want to run a program that will overlay and compile all input data at the track. I hope this helps you get a clearer picture of where I want this to go. Don't worry, any feedback and input is much appreciated. The good idea fairy has been swatted down by research many many times, and I'm. Sure that it will happen several more times before the hardware is even solidified. I've got plenty of time to plan the hardware out properly since the stage 2+ install and protune will be soon. Keeps the modbug from biting me too hard.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
268 Posts
Re: Tofu delivery Special (Porting a set of stock headers)

The list on post two is out of date and when I get home, I'll try to get it more up to date.
- Mass storage will be on a laptop HD.
- check out the storage articles on tweaktown. There's an older article where they did a raid configuration of 4 SSD that was pretty much the ultimate solution for read/write
- I haven't found a decent accelerometer, the one on the carmp3.com store has been sold out for months.
- wireless is a no-go. I'm trying to reduce program overhead and Internet access will require me to have anti-virus software, which usually is a resource hog
- I know the current setup is a bit overkill, but I want a system that will be relatively quick and good for years to come. I a limited by form factor becuase I want to try to fit the entire pc into the dash. OEM like looks is a huge part of my build. Atleast while the unit is off that is. That makes it very difficut to use a double din unit for audio. I haven't seen any clear analysis of sound quality as output by a sound card, but from what I've read, tuning the sound quality of a computer based system is relatively easy because it can be almost automated by some of the programs out there.
I am kind of curious as to the raid configuration article. I found one review of a SSD raid controller, but they were disappointed. I personally just don't see the benefit you'll get from it in a carPC. Read/Write speed really wont' be a big issue in my opinion. However, heat is. I am not up to par with SSD thermal stuff, but that is something to think about. If you plan on using your car to manage tuning (switch between maps while pulled over), you should put reliability at the top of the line. One fault due to high temperature while flashing and your ECU could be a nice paperweight.

Wireless wise, bluetooth might be a nice thing to look into. It would be ashame to not have easy (quality) hands free through the stereo or bluetooth audio streaming after all of it in my opinion.

Audio, I really wouldn't put too much faith into a computer sound card. It honestly might work if you read around, but it is just a strange idea to me. I would look into those "hidden" head units/sound processors. Most high end audio companies (Alpine I know) make them as piggy backs to stock head units. The idea is you can use them instead of a head unit swap. I haven't looked into them too much, but they got amazing reviews. Just passing the signal in the best way possible to one of those might be the way to go debating on the audio quality you are looking for. Tuning wise, all you (ideally should) get out of the 'source' is an equalizer-ish. The 'tuning' of the car system is ideally done in the crossovers. They adjust the frequency cutoffs of the components to achieve a flat response. The equalizer that is easily controllable then is used for 'on the fly' adjustments like turning the bass up for random songs etc. Not sure on your audio wants - it is a big hobby of mine.

Keep in mind, a 1Ghz phone is fast enough to run fast without delays. Just depends what you are running. Most open source type operating systems can be compiled to run just what is needed (ex, android), allowing even simple processors to run very adequately and stable. It is all about what you want it to do. Just don't think of it in terms of desktop computer speed in my opinion. I would probably go overboard, and allow a dual boot configuration. One open source media player based operating system that allows data logging and custom sensor displays. One stable windows boot with nothing but what is needed to flash the ECU safely. Some more ideas to kick around.

I agree with the keep it close to stock build. That is the main reason I have been watching yours for a while. Stuck until February without an STi to build, but my build will probably be very similar to yours.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,733 Posts
Re: Special Edition: Tofu delivery (First Part Bought)

I hear bad things about turbo blankets myself (don't have one, I have no heat shielding either :p). I would personally go with thermal coated compressor housing on a turbo if you can, and then cover up your wires near the turbo (slice a larger silicon hose in half and cover them. Otherwise, find some carbon fiber pieces and make a "make-shift" turbo shield on top of the thermal coating. My 2-cents.

Quick question for anyone out there who has a turbo blanket. My uncle has been told that the turbo blanket can cause your turbo to burn out faster. Is this true? I'd probably still get one anyways....:devil:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,931 Posts
Discussion Starter #88
Re: Tofu delivery Special (Porting a set of stock headers)

Updated the car pc parts list, well... mostly. Havent been doing research on the car pc for the past week and a half because of coming back stateside. That and our "half-day" schedule has been a standard 8 hour work day. :crying:
Didnt get to take any pictures last night, so right after this is posted, I'll be going downstairs to try and get some snapshots of the mostly completed headers.
Called around to inquire about ceramic coating the headers + downpipe this afternoon. Only 1/3 shops I called had any info for me, and he outsources the prep work, which makes it more expensive than competitors. And his standard 3 week turn around didnt exactly have me thrilled. Waiting to hear back from the shop I had to leave a message for the tech at. Hopefully that shop will call me back with a much better turn around time.

I am kind of curious as to the raid configuration article. I found one review of a SSD raid controller, but they were disappointed. I personally just don't see the benefit you'll get from it in a carPC. Read/Write speed really wont' be a big issue in my opinion. However, heat is. I am not up to par with SSD thermal stuff, but that is something to think about. If you plan on using your car to manage tuning (switch between maps while pulled over), you should put reliability at the top of the line. One fault due to high temperature while flashing and your ECU could be a nice paperweight.
Check this one out: Samsung 2.5" 32GB SSD (Four in RAID 0) Benchmarks - HD Tune Pro - Read :: TweakTown USA Edition
this isnt the article that I read origionally, but that page shows some scaling. I'm not confident in the last diagram, what it shows is impossible numerically for the two drive configuration (the average cannot be larger than the maximum speed). I want the entire system minus the amp to sit behind the screen, so cooling shouldnt be an issue given the HVAC routing. There are also some phase change SSD coming out soon... takes around 600 degrees CELCIUS to change the state of the material, so I think it might be durable enough for this application.:D Prices and waiting on the darn things to come out is another story though. I'll have to call some of my friends who keep up with these kinds of things better than I do. If I get a link, I'll make sure to post it up. Reliability is the reason why I want SSD. I have a history of absolutely destroying electronics... I've only destroyed about 6 laptop hard drives:confused:.

Wireless wise, bluetooth might be a nice thing to look into. It would be ashame to not have easy (quality) hands free through the stereo or bluetooth audio streaming after all of it in my opinion.
yep, plan on linking the iphone into the setup with bluetooth. cheapest last time I looked was around $10, which is the one I have listed.

Audio, I really wouldn't put too much faith into a computer sound card. It honestly might work if you read around, but it is just a strange idea to me. I would look into those "hidden" head units/sound processors. Most high end audio companies (Alpine I know) make them as piggy backs to stock head units. The idea is you can use them instead of a head unit swap. I haven't looked into them too much, but they got amazing reviews. Just passing the signal in the best way possible to one of those might be the way to go debating on the audio quality you are looking for. Tuning wise, all you (ideally should) get out of the 'source' is an equalizer-ish. The 'tuning' of the car system is ideally done in the crossovers. They adjust the frequency cutoffs of the components to achieve a flat response. The equalizer that is easily controllable then is used for 'on the fly' adjustments like turning the bass up for random songs etc. Not sure on your audio wants - it is a big hobby of mine.
I'm not an audiophile, and this will the the first car I've even messed with the stereo in. That is a great indicator of my car audio knowledge. Any suggestions in products, etc are appreciated as the time I have now for researching parts for the audio setup is greatly reduced. The first place I looked for car audio was the BOSE website, and they dont do car audio:lol:. I would like my car to sound as good as if not better than my set of BOSE in ear buds. But, I'm betting that quality of sound will cost a pretty penny, so I'm willing to compromise with a setup that puts the stock 4 speaker setup to shame.

Keep in mind, a 1Ghz phone is fast enough to run fast without delays. Just depends what you are running. Most open source type operating systems can be compiled to run just what is needed (ex, android), allowing even simple processors to run very adequately and stable. It is all about what you want it to do. Just don't think of it in terms of desktop computer speed in my opinion. I would probably go overboard, and allow a dual boot configuration. One open source media player based operating system that allows data logging and custom sensor displays. One stable windows boot with nothing but what is needed to flash the ECU safely. Some more ideas to kick around.
Dual boot has been the plan all along, and a light interface should not take longer than a few seconds to start up if done properly. I was looking into centrafuze perviously, but idk if I want to spend $125 for the OS. I need to get the hardware together and then test run out some OS setups before getting that far. Also, I'd rather spend $100 more to have overkill specs than have a bogged down system that doesnt react to massed of data very well. Think about meshing GPS, accelerometer and OBDII at once while displaying real time. I really think that processing requirement might be a bit more than what is necessary to run an iPhone, and I think my phone is slow.

I agree with the keep it close to stock build. That is the main reason I have been watching yours for a while. Stuck until February without an STi to build, but my build will probably be very similar to yours.
Thanks. The smoked lights and the soon to be plasti-dipped grille will be the major deviations from stock.

Thanks for stopping by, pics will be up soon!~
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,931 Posts
Discussion Starter #89 (Edited)
Re: Tofu delivery Special (Stock headers ported)

Here's the first post in a mass of photos I'm sure you'll all enjoy. A link for my flickr page has been added to the first post. Porting headers is also referred to by some people as gasket matching an exhaust manifold. who knew. Anywho, enjoy the holes.

So many holes, still trying to pick a favorite


Crosspipes stack up for comparison



Up-pipe turbo outlet. left it stock diameter, but smoothed it out. Not sure I want to mess with that diameter and make the stock turbo spool later.




Large elbow. notice it is not completely gasket matched. Gotta love when you can quite get that angle you want into a hole.


Large elbow inlet from heads


Nice and lined up, just like it should be


And finally, some gratuitous CARNAGE! I went a hair too far, and then decided that the abomination must be destroyed!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
268 Posts
Re: Tofu delivery Special (Porting a set of stock headers)

The porting job looks awesome man. I'm jealous. I'd foul that stuff up instantly. I've just learned any task requiring a dremel and some skill is best left to somebody other than me.

I'm not an audiophile, and this will the the first car I've even messed with the stereo in. That is a great indicator of my car audio knowledge. Any suggestions in products, etc are appreciated as the time I have now for researching parts for the audio setup is greatly reduced. The first place I looked for car audio was the BOSE website, and they dont do car audio:lol:. I would like my car to sound as good as if not better than my set of BOSE in ear buds. But, I'm betting that quality of sound will cost a pretty penny, so I'm willing to compromise with a setup that puts the stock 4 speaker setup to shame.
Well, that shouldn't be a problem if you do it right. I'd expect to put some money into it, but I think you'd be surprised with your results. I have no knowledge about integrating car PC into it, but I would imagine you'd still want the processing of the head unit. The head unit really is key. I would consider the stereo expenses separate than the carPC ones. It is mostly another project. PXE-H660 is Alpines product I was thinking of. That is a high end unit designed to comply with whatever "control" system you are using. If you want some really nice (basically top notch) quality with some power, I would look into something along those lines as a head unit, three amps (2 amps, one with dual channel would work well), a nice sub enclosure of your choice, and a good set of components for up front. Use an active crossover to control what frequencies go to the sub/mids/highs. You could always just run 2 amps and use the passive crossovers that come with many component systems as well. The biggest suggestion I have with install is to take it in steps if possible. It is easy to run into grounding issues and get some severe gremlin attacks otherwise.

I was just looking at accelerometers the other day. They are not processor intensive, aside from any graphic representation you want. Basically, they are just an analog (or digital if you want - uses a duty cycle representation) out sensor. So it feeds back a voltage 0-5V for example that represents the acceleration in an axis. If you get a 2 or 3 dimensional one, ti would be a 2 or 3 output sensor. The calculation is just a simple voltage scale. I saw somebody who just used an LCD on a breadboard to display the front/back and lateral g's their car was experiencing, and I was surprisingly pleased with the result. I think the whole project ran him $30. http://www.dimensionengineering.com/appnotes/Gmeter/Gmeter.htm
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,153 Posts
Re: Tofu delivery Special (Stock Headers Ported!)

Subscribed. I've also seen you around on Flat4NC.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,931 Posts
Discussion Starter #92
Re: Tofu delivery Special (Stock Headers Ported!)

Looking into local ceramic coating shops currently. Also have my first race this weekend, a rallyx in rougemont,nc.

Interfacing the car pc with audio seems simple from everything I've read, it just requires you to use y cables that go from the standard 3mm Jack to RCA red and white. After that, it's all audio equipment.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
268 Posts
Re: Tofu delivery Special (Stock Headers Ported!)

Good luck with the race!

It can't hurt to try that method. If you listen to it and think you need sound processing, you can always add it in later. Let me know how it turns out.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,931 Posts
Discussion Starter #94
Wirelessly posted

Thanks.
Good idea. I'll look into your amp suggestions and such. I do need to get a base amp for the initial install just to make sure it will power the speakers. Read that frostgate makes some good amps, and I'm not looking for anything expensive for the first attempt. Like you said, any further sound upgrades will be another step.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,931 Posts
Discussion Starter #95
Wirelessly posted

ebo03 said:
Subscribed. I've also seen you around on Flat4NC.
Thanks for looking.
Haven't been on flat4 as much lately since work days have been super long. Making sure to atleast keep my journal as up to date as possbile.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
268 Posts
Re: Tofu delivery Special (Stock Headers Ported!)

Wirelessly posted
Read that frostgate makes some good amps, and I'm not looking for anything expensive for the first attempt. Like you said, any further sound upgrades will be another step.
The biggest problem with amps is running the power properly. I can help you with that and give you a few pointers when you get around to it if you need. It's pretty simple though as long as you fuse correctly and be careful with grounds.

I wouldn't be too worried about a good amp. Audio always has people on both ends of every spectrum, but I would look for whatever is on sale. Just go bottom end. Also, keep in mind some amps power more than one channel, some have crossovers, etc.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,931 Posts
Discussion Starter #97
Wirelessly posted

Heide264 said:
Wirelessly posted
Read that frostgate makes some good amps, and I'm not looking for anything expensive for the first attempt. Like you said, any further sound upgrades will be another step.
The biggest problem with amps is running the power properly. I can help you with that and give you a few pointers when you get around to it if you need. It's pretty simple though as long as you fuse correctly and be careful with grounds.

I wouldn't be too worried about a good amp. Audio always has people on both ends of every spectrum, but I would look for whatever is on sale. Just go bottom end. Also, keep in mind some amps power more than one channel, some have crossovers, etc.
Thanks for the offer. Right now the frostgate is only 100W on all four channels, which is fine for the four speaker setup that the SE comes with. I'll keep looking to see if anything is cheaper, but $100 for a reputable amp seems like a decent deal to me.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,931 Posts
Discussion Starter #98
Re: Tofu delivery Special (Rear overlays on, first 1/4 mi time)

Uploaded all my new pictures to my flickr account, just to find out they changed the stuff around to where I dont have a direct link to photos anymore. And no I can't figure out how to get the photos on here. Will put some more photos up once I figure that out.

In other news, I ran a 14.4 @ 97.13 last night, first run ever. Not too shabby I guess, but not exactly excited about it. Rear Overlays are on, and the photos are up on the flickr page.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,931 Posts
Discussion Starter #99
Re: Tofu delivery Special (Rear overlays on, first 1/4 mi time)

OK, since pictures are now a PITA because of FLICKR. Now that I have a fix, here's some of what was posted yesterday. Next post will have the pictures from the rallyx today

Blue Batmobile overlays on. They will be swapped for paint eventually, the brownish tint is a no-go.


1/4 slip. Not bad for a very first run on a strip ever


The sticker that adds 50 HP


Fresh Wash
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
9,116 Posts
Re: Tofu delivery Special (Rear overlays on, first 1/4 mi time)

decent 60ft for your first time!!!!

why dont they have the 1000ET and MPH working?


btw , cars looking great!

If i can suggest one thing, it'd be to get the black side things instead of the chrome that you got on there!!!


b
 
81 - 100 of 1228 Posts
Top