That's just the synchros resisting you until they've done their job matching shaft speeds. If you rev match and get good at timing how long your shifts take (to match the fall of the engine's RPMs as well) everything is butter smooth.

There's being able to drive stick, and then there's being good at driving stick.

 

what I don't get is why am I feeling this resistance while the clutch is in all the way?

and I was always told that up shifting doesn't require rev matching for daily driving because the engine auto rev matches for you naturally.

anyways I don't want to turn this into a how to drive stick thread.

is that roughness normal? will it damage the transmission? can I counter it with a heavier shift knob for a slightly faster throw?

 

what I don't get is why am I feeling this resistance while the clutch is in all the way?

Doesn't matter. You're clutch disc and input shaft still have inertia and have to be rev matched to the output shaft speed of the gear box. This is what your synchros do.

and I was always told that up shifting doesn't require rev matching for daily driving because the engine auto rev matches for you naturally.

Lol, not that kind of rev matching (engine to tranny). I'm talking rev matching your input to tranny output (sometimes known as double clutching, but not so important on up shifts as down shifts).

is that roughness normal? will it damage the transmission? can I counter it with a heavier shift knob for a slightly faster throw?

It's normal. No, putting a heavier throw on there will not work. Well, it might but I wouldn't recommend it. Your synchros are between the collars and gears in your transmission. When you go to shift they are squished and sandwiched in there so they will bring the gears to nearly the same speed through friction. Putting more pressure on the (like a heavy knob would do) and forcing them to do it harder and faster will wear them out faster.

Learn how your car wants to shift properly. My STI is happiest when I drive it a little more aggressively (i.e. don't beat on it but don't drive it like a granny aka I mode). Shifts are butter smooth then and the shifter practically pulls itself into each gear. No resistance.

If you haven't, you should read this article and learn about what's going on in your transmission. It'll make you a better driver for it. I've taught plenty of people how to drive stick (including my wife) and I always start with making them read this. By the time I'm done with them, they all know the concepts like double clutching, heel-toe, rev matching, engine braking, etc and perform them regularly.

HowStuffWorks "How Manual Transmissions Work"

Come back with more questions after and I'll happily answer them.

In reality, a lot of people don't recognize that you don't need to shift hard to be fast. Even shifting fast is all over-rated and it only for looking cool in a movie, or impress some people that don't have this common knowledge.

QFT. When I drive I shift with two to three fingers. Very light pressure. Now, WOT is of course a different story but every day driving is a very casual flick of the wrist. You'd be surprised how little energy it takes to shift the car when you do it right. Like I said above the shifter practically falls into gear on its own.

 

I don't know about GRs but my shifter is very notchy. I'm sure some of my bushings are shot but still, some resistance is normal

Sent from my Droid

 

ok, my car has 400 miles on it so I was hoping it is normal.

I don't think I have ground a single gear yet, the clutch might hate me some from the first week of ownership but I have been getting better in leaps and bounds but since this is my first manual I needed to know if this is normal

 

Until it refuses to go into gear or grinds no matter how far the clutch is in you are fine. Just keep practicing did you launch from 5k yet? :lol:

Sent from my Droid

 

This happens to every single manual car I own. Every car has its own shift timing that you need to perfect it. When you do rough hard shifting, the gears and shaft in your transmission get misaligned after a while due to all the miss-timed shift.

Here is the fix: Shift extremely gentle without using much force to push the shifter in gear. Do this for a week or 2 depending how bad your had done so far. It'll come back to normal if you haven't ruin anything yet. After that, pay attention and learn the shift timing, don't force the car to do anything it can't.

 

^^^ Yes, that.

 

I just shift when the car tells me... I drive around in I mode...

 

Lame ^^^

 

It doesn't matter what mode you're on or what type of throw your shift lever has. It is just about driving a manual car correctly and it is all about timing. If you don't recognize this soon, some of your gears will break out a couple teeth soon (not kidding), you will hear some weird noise, and then when you drain the trans oil, you'll see it come out.

In reality, a lot of people don't recognize that you don't need to shift hard to be fast. Even shifting fast is all over-rated and it only for looking cool in a movie, or impress some people that don't have this common knowledge.

You won't believe how smooth and slow a race car driver shift.

 

if it feels notchy, work on your own timing. push in the clutch sooner, and shift a hair slower. focus on shifting for a month, and soon, every shift is smooth.

its all about the timing the shift after the clutch is fully dis-engaged. too soon, and its notchy.

 

As others have said, it's all about getting the timing down. I've owned/driven a lot of Hondas and Acuras over the years (which are universally recognized as having great manual transmissions). When shifted correctly, the GR STI's transmission is as smooth and positive-feeling as any Honda/Acura I've ever owned. Sure the throws are heavier and the timing is slightly different (particularly the footwork), but when done correctly, the shifts are smooth as butter.

 

i guess I should be more specific here...

I won't upshift if I know I can't, I am talking about somewhat level streets when I just want to take it easy

if Im going up a hill in 3rd doing 35mile im not going to upshift because the car tells me to.

 

If you are really trying to save fuel with I mode, you shift before it tells you

 

IIRC, he's still in break-in period.

All of the advice here is good, but the truth is the transmission is notchy and sometimes not the easiest to work with for a DD. It takes A LOT more getting used to for things to go buttery smoothly, so hopefully it's not coming across to the OP like he's doing something wrong. Just take your time, feel it out and the crunchiness will fade, if not fully go away.

 

is the transmission warmed up?
When my car's transmission is still cold.. shifting is a little harder. You just have to know how to drive it.

If the problem persists, lmk. i'll be in shelton this weekend.

 

I had the same feeling when I got my car, but after 800 or so miles it will be smooth, the I mode tells me to shift at some weird rpms like 1500 rpm and tells me to go into 6th at like 35 mph... Ha ha

it has gotten alot smoother after the break in period, I have almost 1500 miles on it in one month and 7 days lol

 

Ok, I will try to say what people here are getting at in as simple terms as I can put it in. Do you understand what rev-matching a downshift does? Simply, you are matching the engine speed and transmission speed so they mesh. This means the synchros are not doing the work they do when you don't rev match. This leads to the "buttery" feeling where the gear just slips in with no effort.

Now to apply this same thing on upshifting. The reason people say you don't rev match on upshifts is because the transmission is going faster than the engine, which means you have to wait a split second to get the engine and transmission to match speeds. So as opposed to blipping the gas on downshifts, you wait a fraction of a second on downshifts. This will lead to the "buttery" feeling. Understand so far?

Try this. Lets say your shifting from 3rd to 4th. Push the clutch in fully, and move the shifter down, but not into gear. With super light pressure hold it against the point where it feels notchy. When the engine and transmission meet speeds the knob should just fall into gear. This is the timing people are talking about.

Good luck, hopefully that made sense to you.

P.S. There was a pro driver (I cant remember his name) that said the clutch is only there to help change gears, not actually do it. Once the car is rolling, a clutch is not necessary to drive, you just need to perfectly match the speeds at all times. This should be your goal, but of course use the clutch lol

 

Ok, I will try to say what people here are getting at in as simple terms as I can put it in. Do you understand what rev-matching a downshift does? Simply, you are matching the engine speed and transmission speed so they mesh. This means the synchros are not doing the work they do when you don't rev match. This leads to the "buttery" feeling where the gear just slips in with no effort.

Now to apply this same thing on upshifting. The reason people say you don't rev match on upshifts is because the transmission is going faster than the engine, which means you have to wait a split second to get the engine and transmission to match speeds. So as opposed to blipping the gas on downshifts, you wait a fraction of a second on downshifts. This will lead to the "buttery" feeling. Understand so far?

Try this. Lets say your shifting from 3rd to 4th. Push the clutch in fully, and move the shifter down, but not into gear. With super light pressure hold it against the point where it feels notchy. When the engine and transmission meet speeds the knob should just fall into gear. This is the timing people are talking about.

Good luck, hopefully that made sense to you.

P.S. There was a pro driver (I cant remember his name) that said the clutch is only there to help change gears, not actually do it. Once the car is rolling, a clutch is not necessary to drive, you just need to perfectly match the speeds at all times. This should be your goal, but of course use the clutch lol

^^well put..

yeh subaru is a rough tranny. i just got a 2011 sti as well coming from 06 WRX. i also notice that sti 6mt makes more tranny noise than 5mt.

try that. it takes some time to get the right timing. keep feeling it. you will get it. it took me 2 weeks to get used to the soft clutch and the different timing than 5mt.

 

my confidence level is not at the point where I can try and shift without the clutch I will probably grind the gears

 

Nobody here is suggesting doing that...

 

Yeah never do that.

 

alright so I have been putting the transmission into neutral for a breif second before I shift into the next gear to help me with my timing, but im not double clutching or anything

I am going

1) Clutch in
2) N for a second
3) into next gear with clutch still in
4) roll off clutch

and the roughness seems to be less there, anyone see anything wrong with this technique until I get my timing down even better?

 

That's basically what you need to do, a brief pause in the middle there. When you get good at it that pause is barely noticeable...

 

You're over-thinking it. As long as you don't think faster is better you'll be fine. The car is a machine and you are the operator. Just take your time and you'll figure out what feels right. It might take a little while for things to operate smoothly, but it'll come.

Oddly enough, I had some one in my car last night comment about how he'd never felt a stick-shift feel so smooth. He was young and probably mostly rides around with jerky-driving, lesser-experienced drivers, but I still took the compliment.

 

I went for a drive and I see what you guys are talking about with the clutch in if I go N and then apply a light pressure to the shifter into the next gear when it hits a certain speed the gear slides in with almost no force from me, then when I roll off the clutch the car still engages smoothly.

now that I know what you are talking about I just need to get that timing down but I can feel it on all gears so its a matter of getting comfortable with stick and not rushing the gears.

 

I just change gear. This transmission is NOT smooth. Compared to say... a VW Corrado VR6 (yeah, I know - old!), this is a very herky transmission. But so what? It's an STI because:

1.) It sounds funky
2.) It shifts funky
3.) It rattles like CRAZY (especially in the winter)
4.) It's ugly and attractive all at the same time

This is the way it just is, mmk?

There's no fun in shifting if you're always waiting for what you think is a "perfect" gear change.

 

I like everyone's idea of slowing down here for the OP and see if you can get to a point where you are shifting with minimal force(maybe 2 fingers and a thumb); you can speed up later. Also, look at some you tube videos on rev matching ( I think here are some instructions there). Unlike double clutching or heal-toe (which I don't think on the street are really that useful) I find rev matching something you can use all day every day (it's fun and minimizes the wear on your tranny).
Just be thankful you are not having to learn on a 915 tranny from the 80's (which I'm having the pleasure to (re)learn).

 

yep read post # 29