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Is the swap out of the intercooler to the front worth the money? Does it impact performance in a positive manner? Those who have it are there any regrets? Did you change to a non-scooped hood? How much did it cost for the conversion? Does this change invalidate the engine warranty?Thanks
 

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One question at a time.
Do you change the hood, hell no, that hood looks nice plus fresh air into the engine bay is never a bad thing.
The price is 100% on which one you buy and if you are going to install it yourself or not.
Pretty much anything that you do to your car will void the warantee, yes the frount mount will.
Is it worth it, this is a question that you need to answer, by asking yourself this question, how fast do you want your car to be. Stock this would hurt you, however HEAVILY modded this will help you. What hp/et are you aiming for in your car and at what kind of boost, answer those questions and i will be able to tell you if it is worth it or not.
 

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i don't believe anyone here (non-tuner, that is) has done this conversion as yet (though it seems someone is in the throes of such a job). however, there are several tuners that make this change almost as step 1:

http://www.airpowersystems.com.au/us_spec/subaru/sti/2004_sti.htm
http://www.imprezawrxsti.com/postnuke/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=5185

i think the consensus is that you need to make this change to get big power.

http://www.imprezawrxsti.com/postnuke/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=4353&highlight=fmic

i'd dig around www.nasioc.com. there a lot of wrx fmic conversions. many keep the hoodscoop; doesn't hurt anything. some get an aftermarket hood. regarding warranty, i almost certainly does void the warranty.
 

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I went to to the Perrin FMIC. I really didn't see a performance drop (probably increase), but I didn't dyno this obviously. IMO The TMIC is going to be a big restriction if you are shooting for much more than 350WHP. The car took about 3-5 days before the ECU adjusted to the new IC and the car runs like stock now. One thing is for sure though, the car is so much more consistant now. I don't know if the heat soak of the TMIC was leading to det or not, but the car is always strong now.

I found a really good deal on the FMIC and was able to sell my old TMIC for $425, so this cost me about $1K for an IC about 3X larger. Install wasn't that hard, just time consuming.

 

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twm323gtxsti said:
Is the swap out of the intercooler to the front worth the money? Does it impact performance in a positive manner? Those who have it are there any regrets? Did you change to a non-scooped hood? How much did it cost for the conversion? Does this change invalidate the engine warranty?Thanks
Not worth it on stock programming/stock power in my opinion.

-st
 

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because of their design I suppose. I mean its a difference of running 5"s of piping and 5feet. I guess they like that design better (as it does work) so I honestly dont know. I guess it just suits the engine better and to an engineer it wouldnt make sense to run 5 feet of tubing from point A to point B if you can do it in 5 inches almost. *shrug*

Robert~
 

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staticx313 said:
because of their design I suppose. I mean its a difference of running 5"s of piping and 5feet. I guess they like that design better (as it does work) so I honestly dont know. I guess it just suits the engine better and to an engineer it wouldnt make sense to run 5 feet of tubing from point A to point B if you can do it in 5 inches almost. *shrug*

Robert~
That's basically what I would say also. For the stock engine setup, the TMIC is the most elegant solution if you ask me. The piping is extremely short and the IC gets the job done on the stock setup.

-st
 

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Cheaper, and sufficient for the task it is required to do.

Just like many other things to do with the engine (pistons anyone?) they are passing the savings onto the general buyer, rather than charging everyone for something that is going to cost more and not provide any gains on the stock setup.
 

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bitabur said:
Cheaper, and sufficient for the task it is required to do.

Just like many other things to do with the engine (pistons anyone?) they are passing the savings onto the general buyer, rather than charging everyone for something that is going to cost more and not provide any gains on the stock setup.
Please, I beg you, no more piston debate. At least until people start melting them : )

-st
 

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on the stock turbo I wouldnt expect but maybe a 5-10whp difference with a FMIC (depending on which you get). Go bigger turbo and its a whole new ballgame.

Robert~
 

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gonna blow up...

carnut said:
Thanks staticx313. How limiting will the TMIC be to a larger turbo?
There is no way to know really since no one has tested the stock TMIC. To the best of my knowledge anyway. I found it sort of funny on NASIOC when someone asked APS for this information. They thought it was ridiculous that people would expect this information since it takes so long to do the testing - huh? Seems to me that if there solution is so much better, they would want to directly compare it to the stock unit. Shrug.

-st
 

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I've tested the APS DR650 and with stock ECU it did not make that much power since the ECU pulls tons of timing out. Now after tuning it does make a good solid 20 whp+ gain though and maintains much more consistent than stock TMIC which gets scorching hot after only 2-3 runs on the dyno. Here's a breakdown of how much power you'll make at each stage of the game in my staged packages just to give you an idea on how things play out in terms of power:

Stage 1
consists of following:

Godspeed downpipe
Blitz SUS intake or Turbo XS intake
Greddy E-01 or Blitz SBC_id Boost controller

Approximately 30 wheel HP gain over stock

Stage 1+
Adds:

Greddy E-Manage piggy back ECU and tuning

Approximately 40 wheel HP gain over stock

Stage 2- 400 HP+ package - $3500
Adds:

GT Spec headers
FMIC upgrade

Approximately 65 wheel HP gain over stock.


Now keep in mind that the header and FMIC do not help too much with HP because the turbo is simply maxed out and there is no boost pressure at high RPM's. The torque, however goes from around 250 ft lbs at the wheel to 324 ft lbs at the wheel all on 93 octane at only 16.5 PSI. Baselines were at 15 PSI. So FMIC defiantely helps but maybe is more for folks who want to upgrade turbo later on.
 

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Singletrack said:
carnut said:
Thanks staticx313. How limiting will the TMIC be to a larger turbo?
There is no way to know really since no one has tested the stock TMIC. To the best of my knowledge anyway. I found it sort of funny on NASIOC when someone asked APS for this information. They thought it was ridiculous that people would expect this information since it takes so long to do the testing - huh? Seems to me that if there solution is so much better, they would want to directly compare it to the stock unit. Shrug.

-st
Agreed. If I go the STi route, I think I will put the TMIC to the test. If it works for subey, there has to be some potential.... :D
 

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Compared to other than the STi

It isn't just the length of the pipe, it is also the core itself. The stock core is fairly restrictive when you compare it to the Perrin core.

stock:


perrin:


The other thing you have to think about is contact time. The stock IC is short, and the hot air spend very little time in contact with the core before it moves into the throttle body. Subaru probably designed the core in this restrictive manner to increase the contact time.

Anyway, bottom line is that if nothing else, having the intercooler sitting on top of a hot engine is far from ideal.
 

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Yes singletrack is right... no one would dare test the stock TMIC with a bigger turbo as it alread is pretty maxed out as it is. I would require a new one as the stock TMIC is barely holding upwith stock. I wouldnt commend another TMIC either as the TMIC will get in the way of the plumbing and such of the new turbo and so it'd be just smarter to do the APS DR650 - biggest FMIC out there right now.

Robert~
 

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staticx313 said:
Yes singletrack is right... no one would dare test the stock TMIC with a bigger turbo as it alread is pretty maxed out as it is. I would require a new one as the stock TMIC is barely holding upwith stock.
Just out of curiosity, how do you know when your IC is "maxed out"? Do you monitor post-IC intake air temp vs. ambient?

Also, are people considering temperature-activated automatic IC sprayers before swapping ICs? Seems like a simple, cheap fix for a marginal IC.
 
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