IW STi Forum banner

1 - 20 of 23 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
30 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I finally broke down and purchased an Alpine 9807 head unit today and want to install it when it comes in. My questions are concerning the speakers. I know this has been discussed many times, but still have a few questions (if I overlooked a topic concerning any of this in the search function feel free to let me know :) )

First, I am installing MB Quart DKC 116 6.5" coaxials in the front and Boston Acoustics RX47 4" coaxials in the rear. I know that I will need speaker spacers, but are the IA adaptors the only option (no offense meant at all to [email protected] because they are a great product, but the funds are tight at the moment), can I get away with using the cheap plastic spacers they carry at circuit city or best buy?

My second question involves powering the speakers. The Alpine has 22x4 RMS/50x4 peak and I don't have the cash for an amp at the moment. Will I be ok using the head unit's internal amp until I can get a more powerful amp? The reason I ask is that the Quarts specifically call for a range of 50-100ish watts of power RMS, I'm concerned about the 28 watt deficit of power I will be running. Thanks for the input, I'm excited about finally getting some tunes in this beast.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,033 Posts
I don't know about the cheap spacers... Do they include the little plastic nuts that you push into the square holes in the door to attach the spacers?

I also don't know how efficient the MB Quarts are. I went with CDT components rated for up to 130 W and they're plenty loud with my 40x4 HU.

Sorry I couldn't be more help.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
131 Posts
Slowride,
What CDT's did you get? I just ordered the CL-61a's and CL-5X's. Just wondering how they perform.
PigSTi...sorry for hijacking your thread
Thanks.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
2,802 Posts
You will be ok to use the headunit power with those speakers but they will not sound as good or get as loud as they would with an amp. Even an amp with the same power rating of your headunit will sound better and cleaner.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,033 Posts
fledis said:
Slowride,
What CDT's did you get? I just ordered the CL-61a's and CL-5X's. Just wondering how they perform.
HD-62/CF. I really like them, but can't compare them to anything else because I haven't really heard anything else, other than various OEMs.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
668 Posts
Slowride said:
Do they include the little plastic nuts that you push into the square holes in the door to attach the spacers?
The whajamawhozits? what are these plastic nut things? I don't recall seeing these mentioned before...

Also, one other question, do i need some sort of universal din/holder for the HU or will it just slip into and attach to what's already in the car?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,033 Posts
filbert said:
Slowride said:
Do they include the little plastic nuts that you push into the square holes in the door to attach the spacers?
The whajamawhozits? what are these plastic nut things? I don't recall seeing these mentioned before...
They're part of the IA kits. The door panel has small (about a quarter inch) square holes. These plastic nuts fit in the holes and have screw holes in them, so you pop in the nuts and screw the spacers into the nuts. Check the IA web site and you'll see them.

Also, one other question, do i need some sort of universal din/holder for the HU or will it just slip into and attach to what's already in the car?
Should slip into the OEM DIN bracket. Mine did.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
30 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
thanks to all for the info. If anyone else has any info feel free to post it on up here.

TRM, your instructions are actually the very ones I will be using to install everything, been planning to use them all along as they are very detailed and include great pictures. Thank you for taking the time and effort to post them.
 

·
wie geht es ihnen?
Joined
·
2,218 Posts
PigSTI said:
thanks to all for the info. If anyone else has any info feel free to post it on up here.

TRM, your instructions are actually the very ones I will be using to install everything, been planning to use them all along as they are very detailed and include great pictures. Thank you for taking the time and effort to post them.
very welcome...

North Wales? shucks i could help you if it can wait for a weekend. i'm in Bethlehem - about 40 minutes North of you.

take your time with the door handle plastic covers. they can be a b1tch if you try to remove them to quickly.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,033 Posts
TRM said:
take your time with the door handle plastic covers. they can be a b1tch if you try to remove them to quickly.
I used two small flat-blade screwdrivers to pry the top loose, then slowly but forcefully pulled them the rest of the way off. Go slow so you can feel which way they want to go. They always feel like they're going to break, but I've had them off half a dozen times, and no problems so far.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
30 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
I've heard about the notorious door handles from a few professional installers...hehe, said they were a PIA and to be careful.

Also wanted to update the post because I ordered the IA Adaptors, figured I spent the money on the car, might as well not cheap out over a few bucks saved on some speaker spacers and get the best. Thanks to all for the feedback.

TRM, should be alright on the install with your directions, but thank you for the kind offer. We'll have to see about getting some area STI owners together at some point (or is it that I need to pay more attention to the area forums? :) , could be, either way it would be cool to meet some of the local people on this board. If you could let me know of any upcoming events I would appreciate it greatly.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,482 Posts
Personally, I found that just pulling off the door panels would pop the handle covers right off. They don't break easily. The only part of the door handle trim that has to come off is the very outside trim portion, not the part right over/around the handles themselves.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
586 Posts
Where to TINT in Seattle?

OK, I just got off the phone with God, err, a good friend, Paul, who's a sound engineer. He was on the internet while I was talking to him, he came up with a system for you in about 15 mins. The only major thing is if you decide on getting a subwoofer, you'll have to get a new amp. :-? But this system should sound good enough with an amp driving the MB Quarts, you won't need a sub. ;)
And there is no rush in getting the new amp, just don't play your system very loud and use the built-in EQ in the HU to turn down the bass. That will keep from damaging the speakers, though that is highly unlikely anyways.

You seem to have a good grasp on matching the power ratings.
But in case you didn't know: Frequency Response is the range of sound that a speaker can reproduce, sound signals that are lower or higher than the frequency response range won't be heard, they will be wasted energy. Bass signals are a lot stronger than high signals so you only have to worry about the lower end of the frequency response. I'll have to check with Paul for a technical explanation of where that energy goes.
But just remember, sending signals to the speakers lower than the frequency response is bad.

__________________________________________________________

Head Unit: Alpine 9807
Power: 23 Watts x 4 RMS
50 Watts x 4 Peak

Front Components:
MB Quart DKD 116 6.5" Coaxials
Power Range: 50 - 120 Watts RMS
Frequency Response: 40 Hz - 32 kHz

Back Components:
Boston Acoustics RX47 4" Coaxials
Power Range: 12 - 120 Watts RMS
Frequency Response: 85 Hz - 20 kHz

__________________________________________________________

To match your components, the amp needs to be the following:
2 channel to power Front Components only, the rear speakers are already right in the power range and will not sound much better with more power.
Power Range: 70 - 120 Watts RMS
Frequency Response: 40 Hz - 35 kHz

__________________________________________________________

The amp model we came up with is the Alpine MRV - T420
Power: 110 x 2 Watts RMS @ 4 ohms
Frequency Response: 10 hz - 50 khz
Crossover (High-Pass): 30 - 400 Hz
Crossover (Low-Pass): 15 - 400 Hz
Size: 9-3/4" x 2-1/2" x 12-3/8"

The power rating on this amp, at 110 watts RMS, is at the upper end of the power range for the speakers. This give you lots of bass and will be better matched to the MB Quarts.

Turn off the Low-Pass Crossover.
Set the High-Pass Crossover at 40 Hz.
This a simple to use feature built into this amp.

The High-Pass Crossover cuts off the sound signals at 40 Hz, which means no sound signals lower than 40 Hz will be sent to the speakers. Which is perfect as the low end of the frequency response for the speakers is 40 Hz. Isn't great when things work? ;)

The Low-Pass Crossover regulates the upper end of the bass frequencies. This is so if you were to use this amp to power a subwoofer only, you can cut off the high frequencies, which are bad for subs.

In this case, the Low-Pass is turned off so you can actually hear the upper range.

Also, per Alpine, use at least 8 gauge speaker wire and power wire for the amp.

You can get the Alpine MRV T420 for about $400, I found a few sales online for $350. This is the third cheapest amp Alpine makes, and being all you need and proven Alpine quality, it's a good deal.

If you aren't that concerned with lots of bass and want to save some dough, the Alpine MRV-T320 has the same specs and would be set up the same way except the power is 80 watts x 2 RMS. You get this amp for $200.

I hope this helps you, any questions, let me know.
PM me if you want Paul's cell #.


EDIT: Alpine said to use 8 gauge or thicker wire for the power leads and speaker connects. I don't know how, but I forgot to mention one of Paul's most repeated audio tips. Use the biggest wire you can, 4 gauge for the power leads and speaker connects to/from the amp. Use 8 gauge from HU to amp and to rears. This will make a big difference especially since all bass will be from the fronts. Paul said with the components you've already got, you can make this system sound better than a lot of systems with subs if you don't cut corners on the crucial details like wire and the install. 8)
Also, I didn't mention your mounting bracket spacers, but I know Paul would have ripped on the "cheap plastic" ones like there was no tomorrow. Good to hear you're going with the IA spacers.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
30 Posts
Discussion Starter #15
wow M thanks a ton, and I really appreciate you asking a friend about it for me (who obviously knows his stuff). I was thinking about just adding an external amp to the front speakers at some point, when I can save up some more play money, but your/your friend analysis makes it sound like the way to go for sure. And again thank you for the in-depth response....have to save this post to my computer :D
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
586 Posts
No prob, I enjoyed doing it for ya, I always learn more than I need to know every time I talk to Paul about audio.
And the best part is, he is awesome at installs and loves doing 'em for the fun of it. I can get all the top-notch audio help I want for free. Let me know when you get that amp, I know I can get you all the help you'll ever need on wiring and amp placement. ;)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
60 Posts
hey good info here!

Would it be better "generally" to install a 4-channel amp and power the rears as well? or would a 2 channel work better just to fronts?

everything powered by head-unit now. i'm gettin' an amp. (which one?)
Alpine h/u 40x4 (forgot model?) -- need to lookup
polk dx components front 6.5"
polk ex rears 5.25"

THanks. :roll:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
146 Posts
M-
I just had installed the MB Quarts PSD 213 components up Front and the PKC 113's in the rear and I am running them off of the Alpine V12 MRV-F340 amp. I have a Pioneer DVH-MP5000 as my HU. I got my car back and I will post pics tomorrow on a new thread but right now I am not happy with the sound. They said they could not fit 6 1/2 in the front's as they were to deep so they installed the 5 1/4. The high's are unbearable. I really do not know much about car audio and went on recommendations from other people. All I know is that I need some bass very soon. I did not want to get a sub but I guess I am going to know. Any recommendations like adjusting the amp or something? I really have no idea what I am doing.

Also, I have the Alpine TME-m580 installed in the double din and my HU is a DVD player and was wondering if you can tell me how I take off the wire from the hand brake and make it work when the car is in motion. I plan on getting Nav and that was the reason behind the monitor but since I have a DVD player I would like to disable this feature.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
586 Posts
flyin-sti said:
Would it be better "generally" to install a 4-channel amp and power the rears as well? or would a 2 channel work better just to fronts?

everything powered by head-unit now. i'm gettin' an amp. (which one?)
Alpine h/u 40x4 (forgot model?) -- need to lookup
polk dx components front 6.5"
polk ex rears 5.25"
Yes, it's "generally" better to amp all 4 channels, but it really goes on an individual basis. You'll need to amp the rear components if you have big enough rear speakers and the minimum of the power range is above the power output of the head unit. The reason I/Paul recommended that PigSTi not amp the rears is they were quite small, 4" and were already in the power range. Rears had power range of 12 - 120 Watts RMS, the HU was rated at 23 Watts RMS per channel. There was no technical necessity to amp them.

Another factor to consider is more subjective, how loud and how much bass do you want? If you're looking for the most bass possible without a sub, then large front and rear components plus a 4 channel amp is a must. but if you're just looking for a clean sounding system, the a 2 channel amp may be fine for you. Also Paul told me that top-notch systems setup for SQ (sound qaulity) put a lot more emphasis on the front components. This makes it sound like your facing the music, with less sound from the back (called rear fill). This is a matter of personal preference, but the technical truth is that the front components are the speakers you'll hear a lot louder and clearer at the same volume setting than the rears.

I have no idea what the specs are on your component speakers, but I'd guess that with the 5-1/4" rears are big enough that they wil need to be amped so the power range of the speakers matches the power output of the HU.

I can't help anymore without the exact model #s of your system. If you get me those specs, I'll be able to help you a lot more. Also figure out how important big bass and having rear fill is to you.

Thanks
8)
 
1 - 20 of 23 Posts
Top