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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
With the advent of worldwide realization of a more green planet and heavy competition, technology has moved the automotive world towards the direction that is sometimes radically different than their predecessors in their production car "halo" cars. Change is inevitable, but do you, as an automotive enthusiast, feel that this is the right move? Do you prefer auto manufacturers keep an old technology and improve upon them?

Some, but not limited examples:
- Naturally aspirated vs Turbocharged BMW M3, M5, M6
- Supercharged V8 vs Twin Turbo V6 Cadilac ATS-V, Ford GT
- Inline-6s vs V6s Nissan Z
- Rear solid axle vs IRS Ford Mustang GT
- MacPherson Rear Struts vs Multilink Rear Subaru WRX
- Manual vs Automatic/Semiautomatic Transmission (DSG, Lineartronic CVT, PDK, TC-SST, etc)

Other debates:
Driving thrill vs driving fast
Worth vs overpriced
Form vs Function
 

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good idea for a thread, in light of current debates in the other threads.

Progress involves change. Humanity cannot survive without progress. People stuck in their ways and stuck relying on tradition will not benefit from it. Companies who do not keep with the current trends and technology are destined for failure. I think that it is nice to see new technology, and I think it is foolish to believe that we can stick with old technology due to tradition and dig our own graves.

that said, to those saying the Ford GT should have incorporated the V8; I disagree wholeheartedly. There are many benefits to progressing towards the newer platform. Just look at the way that formula 1 racing evolves for example. Heavier restrictions forces people to evolve and technology to evolve, efficiency becomes greater, we learn to get the same outputs from less input. Right now the automotive industry is extremely competitive, especially in technology. Things that nobody knew existed 10-15 years ago are now becoming standard. A company cannot remain stagnant in technology because as soon as they do, they will be left in the dust.
 

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Progress involves change, but I don't think many here will argue this.

What is argued is how much automation should replace the driver/racer.
In terms of transportation, cost/safety/speed will always rule.
For drivers? Were on a slippery slope at the edge of a cliff! This is a big part of my motivation in building my GD. I believe we are now nearing the very last time true performance cars will be common, driven by humans, and have any room to do what we want on the street.

Luckily for us the is that there is some monetary gain for auto manufacturers to produce these cars, so they will fight to be able to produce them. But it won't be that long before there will be enough speed cameras ect that you won't be able to drive anyway. When people stop buying these cars, they will no longer be produced. How long do you expect it to take before humans are considered to dangerous to drive outside a track? I say shorter than most of us would guess.
 

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Progress involves change, but I don't think many here will argue this.

What is argued is how much automation should replace the driver/racer.
In terms of transportation, cost/safety/speed will always rule.
For drivers? Were on a slippery slop at the edge of a cliff! This is a big part of my motivation in building my GD. I believe we are now nearing the very last time true performance cars are common, driven by humans, and have any room to do what we want on the street.

Luckily for us the is some monetary gain for auto manufacturers to produce these cars, so they will fight to be able to produce them. But it won't be that long before there will be enough speed cameras ect that you won't be able to drive anyway. When people stop buying these cars, they will no longer be produced. How long do you expect it to take before humans are considered to dangerous to drive outside a track? I say shorter than most of us would guess.
I constantly think of an approaching day and age where driving is all automatic. I can see it now, the slogan 'Traffic will be no more' for the lazy people who can't drive to just sit there and let all the cars drive themselves. Pretty much like in Minority Report. It will be horrible.
 

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Automation is going to be the future. That is has been evident for a while. Think about when you call a corporate co. no one is live everything is automated. It's not surprising to see cars drive themselves in the future. Would change the insurance game dramatically those premiums would have to drop!
My point is when it comes to technology which has progressed at an alarming rate for vehicles when it comes to safety and drivers aids, traction control etc. When does driving not really become driving? There is a fine line between aiding the driver and having a car take over. We are nearing that divide soon.
My question is that with all this technology why are we making 700hp cars? Where are you going to drive that? Honestly 300hp is plenty for the street. Average family sedan is making close to 300hp these days and the M3 is at 400hp. I know my speed limit in IL is 55mph. It's great to make a lot of power but where do you use it?
 

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Automation is going to be the future. That is has been evident for a while. Think about when you call a corporate co. no one is live everything is automated. It's not surprising to see cars drive themselves in the future. Would change the insurance game dramatically those premiums would have to drop!
My point is when it comes to technology which has progressed at an alarming rate for vehicles when it comes to safety and drivers aids, traction control etc. When does driving not really become driving? There is a fine line between aiding the driver and having a car take over. We are nearing that divide soon.
My question is that with all this technology why are we making 700hp cars? Where are you going to drive that? Honestly 300hp is plenty for the street. Average family sedan is making close to 300hp these days and the M3 is at 400hp. I know my speed limit in IL is 55mph. It's great to make a lot of power but where do you use it?

Some people do break the speed limit every now and again:cool: If you're smart about it there is little risk.

Give it another 10 years or less and cars will be coming with 1000HP from the factory, and getting sick MPG while doing it.

Is it bad I find 340WHP not enough for daily driving?:rofl:
 

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I am all for technological advancement, but please sweet jesus, dont take my manual transmission away.
Rest assured, that would never happen, you know, cuz Jesus Built My Hot Rod.





 

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Discussion Starter #12 (Edited)
Cars can already drift and park themselves :rolleyes: we're already there... might as well get rid of rollercoasters and make tracks days with automated racecars as our new amusement parks :lol:

I just want a lighter, faster car. :)
Here's your answer ;)



Is it bad I find 340WHP not enough for daily driving?:rofl:
Just don't be like this guy, who has 430bhp and 360 ft lb to boot ;)

 

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Automation is going to be the future. That is has been evident for a while. Think about when you call a corporate co. no one is live everything is automated. It's not surprising to see cars drive themselves in the future. Would change the insurance game dramatically those premiums would have to drop!
My point is when it comes to technology which has progressed at an alarming rate for vehicles when it comes to safety and drivers aids, traction control etc. When does driving not really become driving? There is a fine line between aiding the driver and having a car take over. We are nearing that divide soon.
youre right. this is what happens when we let unelected progressive bureaucrats shape our future instead of allowing the free markets, human nature and personal freedom chart the course. our education system is churning out frightened politically correct zombies with zero survival instinct.

we're about to hit a moment in history where you won't want to take your new street car to the track because there's no switch to turn off the fucking traction control and other nannies.

if i sound angry and defiant, it's because i'm angry and defiant.

My question is that with all this technology why are we making 700hp cars? Where are you going to drive that? Honestly 300hp is plenty for the street.
i don't want ANYONE deciding for me that _____ (fill in the blank) hp is plenty for the street. i'll figure that out for myself, thanks.

Average family sedan is making close to 300hp these days and the M3 is at 400hp. I know my speed limit in IL is 55mph. It's great to make a lot of power but where do you use it?
you do 55. just stay out of the passing lane. lol
 

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youre right. this is what happens when we let unelected progressive bureaucrats shape our future instead of allowing the free markets, human nature and personal freedom chart the course. our education system is churning out frightened politically correct zombies with zero survival instinct.

right now, we have an entire generation of twenty-something babies living with their parents just rolling over and playing dead because theyre willing to trade away personal freedom and responsibility for parental supervision into middle age and the mediocrity of socialism and "income redistribution". if you want big brother assholes like hillary clinton, mike bloomberg and chuck schummer regulating your life, telling you how much soda to drink and handing out free shit, keep electing liberal asswipes.

we're about to hit a moment in history where you won't want to take your new street car to the track because there's no switch to turn off the fucking traction control and other nannies.

if i sound angry and defiant, it's because i'm angry and defiant.



frankly, i don't want ANYONE deciding for me that _____ (fill in the blank) hp is plenty for the street. i'll figure that out for myself, thanks.



anywhere i fucking want. you do 55. just stay out of the passing lane. lol

(none of this is personal. i'm a holdover from a time when you survived or died by your personal initiative)
Love this. 'Progress' isn't always a good thing. I still use carbureators on our race cars, and I don't want someone telling me I can't. The green movement is a dangerous thing, and giving it governmental authority is bound to kill the performance car along with all our individuality.
 

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If you want an automated car then take a cab. As a back up plan I will start collecting 60's muscle cars and storing them for when the time comes.

On a side note I did see a documentary that said they would need to produce gasoline for about thirty years after the last combustion engine left the assembly line. As long as Im driving it will be driven by me and powered by the dinosaur juice.
 

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'Pure progress' or whatever the market dictates. One can buy an older car if 'traditional' is wanted (that's what I do). Just as long as we're still able to keep driving the old cars on the road I'm good.
Problem is, if v2v communication becomes the law of the land, eventually you won't have an old car to go to. All the new ones will be loaded up w nanny tech and inevitably they'll make some stipulation to be sure the old cars aren't around forever.

It really is sad that we had such a short time with technologically advanced cars for driver's enjoyment before it began being geared toward control and laziness
 

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Car entusiasts are a slim number compared to the grande picture. 98% of people want something reliable to make point A to B. Driving is a hassle business to those... and dangerouss. Automotion will prevail and crush the minority, which is what entusiasts are. The majority always crushes the minority in the end no matter what its is. I have read somewhere that eventualy driving will be made illegal... We're not there yet but its coming. lAwyers oblige...
 

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Exactly. That is the eventuality of it if they are going to truly have autonomous cars. For that to work out, then eventually they need 100% of roadgoing vehicles to be on whatever "grid" is involved whether it's V2V communication or much more of a centralized "traffic orchestra." Traffic signals etc will be gone because instead of traffic lights, the central computer will direct the minute changes in speed and direction. On one hand sure, it would be nice because you probably won't need to actually STOP all that often, because they can allow vehicles to pass within a foot of each other unscathed while travelling at normal speeds, but on the other hand for me at least it's not worth the loss of freedom of driving.

I don't know when the above will happen, but I do feel it is inevitable at some point. Sadly, as others have mentioned, I think our "societal progress" has accelerated drastically in the past decade or two, so I think it will come along faster than we anticipated (or would like).

There may still be a gray market of cars but they will all say "for off road use only" on their website ads :lol:
 
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