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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have two 05 STi's and both cars are running AP's. I never had any problems installing the AP's in the stage two 93 maps I didnt feel any real power change but I know a protune will fix that.

But my real question is that I have heard from several shops (funny thing is, dont sell cobb) that cobb AP's are not a good tuning tool and there are several issues with them. So much as they even said that cobb is in the middle of changing the AP's in order to fix the problem. Is this true and why is cobb not saying that theres a problem if there is. I want to go big later on the turbo and a stroker kit so I am going to be pissed if this AP wont work for me since it would have been as waste of money. Please straighten this out for me and tell me theres some of you with gt35r's running the AP with no problems.
 

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fuzz said:
You did'nt feel a power change when you flashed stg 2:confused:
:yeahthat: stage 2 pulls so hard:confused:
 

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There have to be well over 1,000 happy Cobb AP customers with STi's. There might be that many here on the board...

We made 477 whp on a GT30R the other day with nothing but an AP and an AVC-R (and meth of course ;) )

SS
 

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ISpeedUSA said that they don't tune using AP/Protuner for the same reasons. Something that they are waiting for Cobb to fix/change. (But, then I realized that Crawford was associated with ISpeed, so I had a tuner fly across country.)
 

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Ecutek "just" reprograms the stock ECU. It doesn't add or take anything away from the capability of the stock ECU. Ecutek gives a tuner access to as much as they can. It's a full-on major company, that supports their customers to the best of their ability. Their response to customer support is AMAZING. Things almost always ship IMMEDIATELY on request. I have been on the phone with the guys in England late Friday night, when I'm sure they want to go home, and they have always been VERY helpful.

There have been LOTS of cars that run PERFECTLY at every power level with Ecutek. The only "option" that many people would like is multiple maps. Well, the stock ECU doesn't really have the ability to hold multiple maps, so Ecutek can't "create" that ability.

That brings us to Cobb AP. The AP is basically "Ecutek in a box." That box, the port itself, can hold a few "Ecutek-like" maps. Cobb is also a very "real" company. They have a team of engineers continuously working to make the best product they can. Their support is also AMAZING. I've gotten responses from their tech support in 20 SECONDS on a SUNDAY night.

The way the car runs is virtually IDENTICAL between Ecutek and AP. They both are just reprogramming the stock ECU.

There are definite advantages and dis-advantages to each.

AP's most obvious advantage is the multiple maps. You can change between real-time maps in 10 seconds, while driving, and you can do it as many times as you want. The ability to real-time tune is also a MAJOR advantage.

Ecutek's biggest advantage is that, not having any hardware, it's virtually "bug-free." You drop the "whole" map each time, and you know EXACTLY what's going in, and it only takes about 20 seconds. Ecutek's second biggest advantage is Delta Dash. We tune over 20 different kinds of EM here, and DD is BY FAR the best Datalogging and viewing software EVER.

AP's biggest "disadvantage" is that some variables are Base-Maps. These base maps take near 30 MINUTES to change. So when you are tweaking in base-map values, it's a real pain. Also, some things are "sort-of" real map and "sort-of" base map. (Can be tuned real, but only saved base).

Ecutek's biggest disadvantage is probably just that it's not easy for an end-user to change maps, and there is still a finite "lifespan" for reflashes (near 200).

Basically, they are hard to complain about, unless that shop just doesn't want to deal with them.

SS
 

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The one thing I can think of that would send a company away from AP technology is the sometimes necessary action of running a realtime and base map. The current AccessPORTs don't have enough memory to hold every single change in a base map. This can be a bad thing ... especially from a tuner's perspective. Why? Because if the tuner has made so many changes that the user must use a base and a realtime map for a safe tune, then the tuner is setting themselves up AND setting the client up for big problems. If, for some reason, the customer disconnects the battery and forgets to load the realtime map onto the ECU, then a meltdown could occur.

This only occurs in cars that need a crapload of maps changed on the base. Furthermore, there is often a way to make a safe base map and allow the realtime to be the normal higher output map.

t
 

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there are many folks turning huge numbers on AP with zero problems. You need to take what you hear with reservation. Each tuner has their likes and dislikes about certain tools. I would discount the "Wanna be" tuners opinion, as just that....
 

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There have to be well over 1,000 happy Cobb AP customers with STi's. There might be that many here on the board...

We made 477 whp on a GT30R the other day with nothing but an AP and an AVC-R (and meth of course ;) )

SS

So, let's say you have COBB AP and later you want to upgrade with a GT30, GT35 or a TSR70 turbo ... Does the AP will make any difference or should you manage it with a different program?
Sorry for the dumb question:p
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
This is what I figured... Thanks for the confimation on the info. I am not sure why I dont get much "feel" in the stage two, I have been getting 19psi and tappers off to 17.5psi which I figure is about right. My stock turbo is not ported and I havent seen any real boost creep either.

Like I said in the first post, the shop that thinks this doesnt sell cobb so I figure he is just blowing smoke.
 

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Ok, so aside from cost, why doesn't anyone use the UTEC anymore? I had it on my 03 WRX and loved it. It has much more capability than the EcuTek or AP. Such as launch control, selanoid control, instant and easy map changes, etc.
 

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LOLSTi said:
That's incorrect, that's why.
ok, so the AP and Ecutek have switch on the fly maps? They can control selenoids for NOS, Meth, water injection, etc.? They have launch control?

I'm pretty sure there's no port on your ECU to hook up a map selector switch, selenoid, or launch control switch. And their websites say nothing about these things. so tell me, how am I incorrect?
 

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Mr.C said:
ok, so the AP and Ecutek have switch on the fly maps? They can control selenoids for NOS, Meth, water injection, etc.? They have launch control?

I'm pretty sure there's no port on your ECU to hook up a map selector switch, selenoid, or launch control switch. And their websites say nothing about these things. so tell me, how am I incorrect?
UTEC doesn't control stuff like ...

AVCS
Pump Shot
Max Airflow
Throttle Duty
ECU Intake calibration
50,000 stock environmental tables
etc, etc, etc

On top of that, AccessPORT can switch maps easily. It might not be a flip of the switch, but it is just as useful (15 seconds to switch a map).

The stock ECU is much more adaptable. UTEC is going in the correct direction with their latest release but they are still a piggyback. For a daily driver a stock ECU flash is the best choice bar none. I'd prefer to keep the stock adaptability and the stock functionality as opposed to ditching that and gaining solenoid switching. The AP will soon have supported launch control (and WOT shifting has already been done with it).

t
 
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