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Discussion Starter #1
Hi everyone,
Got some questions about my car I need answers to and basically looking for a second opinion from what the shop has been telling me.

Here’s a recap of my car and What brings me here to you all. Had my motor built by a shop in my town. Pretty much all the fun stuff besides close deck or sleeves.

Stock bore Manley pistons
Stock crank
Manley rods
King bearings
FP red 35 r turbo
Perrin Front mount intercooler
Perrin Cold air intake
Perrin 3” turbo inlet
Perrin Air oil separator
TGV deletes
Detschuts works 1300cc injectors
Aeromotive 235 fuel pump
Cobb Fuel pressure regulator kit
3" invidia down pipe
3” Cobb cat back exhaust catted
2.5" Grimm speed uppipe with 38mm EWG
Agency Power equal length Header
Gcs cams 272
Titanium valves
APR head studs.
8.8 compression
Thicker head gasket
Cobb short shifter and shifter bushings.
Act 6 puck clutch

Blah blah. So. 35psi on FP RED made 590/500. Took it in to a shop and long story short is they dropped the timing belt off the front of my car while they were driving and basically destroyed my motor. They found a time Sert in my idler pulley hole in the block on passenger side. After a lot of complaining the shop decided to “rebuild” my motor to what I had it at. They had a machine shop in town do it. They apparently had it built “loose”. The new shop I go to says it’s so loose it is basically worse than a stock motor with no oil pressure and terrible compression. So if you are still reading here’s where I’m at.

Low oil pressure. 60psi oil pressure on start up. 40 when driving. 10-15 at idle.
Low compression tests. 90psi all around
Leak down test at 2%
Excessive oil consumption 2-3 quarts per 3000 miles
Low low end power.
Clicking heads
Can’t make more than 29lbs of boost
Boost doesn’t come on until 4800. Full boost at 5800. FP red. 38mm EWG. Cobb 3 port.
Falls on its face and isn’t fast or responsive.
Oil out exhaust on start up

Shop says the motor is too loose and bearings clearances, piston to wall clearance, and ring gap is out of spec. The 90psi compression test on all 4 cylinders is what worried me. Does this sound like a crap motor or am I missing something. Just looking. For a second opinion before I decide what to do. Thank you all for reading.

TL/DR. Had motor built. Shop blew it up. “Rebuilt” motor and reinstalled. Runs like crap and has no power and really low compression as well as oil pressure. Looking for opinions on this motor. Thanks.
 

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So this car has been to 3 shops? Am i right in reading all of that? Why would they built it "loose" and not back to the prior specs?

Before comdemning the engine, have any of the shops done any other diag besides compression/leakdown. Has the engine been checked for any air leaks/vacuum leaks? What about timing? Has that been verified to be correct? Also is the correct head gasket being used for your engine? An engine can have Low compression across the board but still be powerful but i feel like 90psi all around is pretty low.

All kinds of bearing issues can attribute to low oil pressure but so can a faulty/incorrect oil pump. What kind of oil pump are you using here? I feel like there is alot of information missing here.

I think you need to have a serious conversation with whoever rebuilt your engine.
 

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What you wrote yourself.

You need a shop you (can) trust.
 

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Yikes, this is a mess

oil pressure is pretty low. The FSM specs 47 psi >2000 RPMs and 14 psi at 600 rpms at 195 degrees.

Your compression is low, likely due to excessive PTW clearance or bad ring gaps. Generally you want above 100 psi compression, but no more than 10% between different cylinders.

if this were my car, I'd stop driving it and whoever built the piece of shit would be seeing a lot more of me until they fixed it.

thats unacceptable.
 

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My car was re-tuned a year or two ago I was warned that my compression was getting low - at 135 or 145 - I forget . . .

I like to do my own work. I wasn't always set up to do it, and I don't always have time. When beneficial to me I get my car 4hrs away to to a shop I trust. They aren't perfect, but they do good work. They fix the issue and I don't find loose parts or missing bolts. If they break something, I know they can make it right whatever it is.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Hey guys. Thanks for all the responses. Yes it is a massive mess.
I don’t go to this shop that did this anymore, call them “A”. For obvious reasons.
But the new shop, let’s called them “B”, wants 8k to redo shop “A’s” mess up. When all this happened I told shop A to fix my car to what it was at before. So low and behold 6 months later they deliver me this hunk of crap. No clearance. No compression ratio. No receipt of what they did. They had a machine shop build the short block. They won’t release any specs to me cuz “I didn’t pay for it” ?. This machine shop also does not build Subaru motors well, found this out afterwards. Buddy of mine had his built there and it spun a bearing after 500miles. I’m going with pistons and rings for sure. It just sounds like there could be a lot kore demons inside than I think.
Oil pump is unknown.
Headgasket is OEM
Unknown compression ratio before hand
Compression test done hot and cold. Wet and dry. Did it myself.
Tuner says he can’t add more timing because it will knock. So I’m SOL on that. He also states low compression is why I can’t make more than 29psi. Which makes sense. Wife doesn’t want me to fix this motor or buy a short block so I’m trying to figure it out on what to actually do.

Oh and you’ll get a kick out of this. Upon delivery of new motor and car from shop A. They told me I had to do 5k of break in before they would tune it. ?. This all sucks. Thank you all so much.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Oh sorry. Oil pressure read from electric oil pressure gauge. Changed out oil pressure sending unit and confirmed on mechanical gauge as well. So it’s real. It also drinks a ton of oil. And I’m running VR1 20W-50 and still have crappy oil pressure.
 

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yeah, I'm sorry this happened to you.

Since you confirmed oil pressure with a mechanical gauge, your best bet is to get rid of the car at a loss and sue Shop A in small claims for your money, or fix said car.

but it sounds like they had no idea what they were doing, and screwed you in the process.
 

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Sorry for you. It is sad :(
 

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After reading the response, this is just terrible! If the machine shop built the engine then it is the responsibility shit shop A and machine shop to repair this car again! To the OP, you may want to consider contacing the BBB about this and also the FTC. Inform your local goverment and news stations aswell. If what you say about all this is honest and true then i really wish you the best of luck. Unfortunatly places that do work like this, cant afford to do better.

If your going to redo the engine, then I dont think you should do just pistons and rods. Think you should just replace the whole short block and start fresh. If you decide to have it done somewhere, i would highly recommend having 1 reputable and reliable subaru shop remove, rebuild, install, and tune the car.
 

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Thanks everyone. I appreciate the responses. I figured I was pretty much screwed. There was no receipt from either shop A or the machine shop. They basically did everything under the table and handed me the keys to a car that runs but pretty much terribly. They said it’s “built to last forever”. Whatever that means. Guess it doesn’t make any power so it won’t blow up haha. This does suck for sure. I just needed the confirmation from other people since shop B has people who worked at shop A at it and I’m in a pretty small town and can’t afford to shop the car to any super reputable shops. Long story short I got screwed. Thanks for confirming friendly internet people. Much appreciated. But I agree. It will probably be a new short block in the future.
 

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Thanks everyone. I appreciate the responses. I figured I was pretty much screwed. There was no receipt from either shop A or the machine shop. They basically did everything under the table and handed me the keys to a car that runs but pretty much terribly. They said it’s “built to last forever”. Whatever that means. Guess it doesn’t make any power so it won’t blow up haha. This does suck for sure. I just needed the confirmation from other people since shop B has people who worked at shop A at it and I’m in a pretty small town and can’t afford to shop the car to any super reputable shops. Long story short I got screwed. Thanks for confirming friendly internet people. Much appreciated. But I agree. It will probably be a new short block in the future.

No receipts for a build or even a repair after, oh boy. Something like this being an under the table kind of thing really just gives you nothing to really stand on here. I do think you are now SOL, sorry for your loss sir. If people from shop A are now working at shop B, then it might be best to stay clear of both. I wish you the best of luck sir.
 

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You start out saying "Took it in to a shop and long story short is they dropped the timing belt off the front of my car while they were driving and basically destroyed my motor. They found a time Sert in my idler pulley hole in the block on passenger side. After a lot of complaining the shop decided to “rebuild” my motor to what I had it at."
Is "a shop" the "A" shop or "B" shop? Did shop B destroy the engine? Who agreed to rebuild it?
Shop A or B is responsible for what they sub out to a machine shop.

Looking at your build, several things jump out at me. Way too much boost (35 PSI) for basic APR (SIC) studs, not being closed deck and not having special head sealing.
You may be from a small town but you act like you are a pawn in this fiasco. You should be suing them. Then you say you don't have money to get it done right. You are asking for it. I would get a lawyer, but if you have no documentation or proof you probably won't get far. At least get a lawyer to threaten them to give you your money back.
 

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Blah blah. So. 35psi on FP RED made 590/500. Took it in to a shop and long story short is they dropped the timing belt off the front of my car while they were driving and basically destroyed my motor. They found a time Sert in my idler pulley hole in the block on passenger side.
You start out saying "Took it in to a shop and long story short is they dropped the timing belt off the front of my car while they were driving and basically destroyed my motor. They found a time Sert in my idler pulley hole in the block on passenger side. After a lot of complaining the shop decided to “rebuild” my motor to what I had it at."
Is "a shop" the "A" shop or "B" shop? Did shop B destroy the engine? Who agreed to rebuild it?
Shop A or B is responsible for what they sub out to a machine shop.


This is what makes things complicated. If you bring a failing car to a shop, few will take responsibility for things that break that they don't feel they were responsible for. Places I am familiar with you sign off on this for example before a dyno.

Rule 1 - one shop builds assembles, and tunes.

Is there something wrong with a TimeSert? I wouldn't think so if installed properly. Helicoils are often used to strengthen threads in soft material like out blocks. Of course they must be installed properly.


Looking at your build, several things jump out at me. Way too much boost (35 PSI) for basic APR (SIC) studs, not being closed deck and not having special head sealing.
You may be from a small town but you act like you are a pawn in this fiasco. You should be suing them. Then you say you don't have money to get it done right. You are asking for it. I would get a lawyer, but if you have no documentation or proof you probably won't get far. At least get a lawyer to threaten them to give you your money back.
Boost and accommodation - Good point Scargo - and 600 is very high for a DD - though it can be done, just not cheaply and well together. If funds are an issue, I'd suggest to dial it back a bit - though that could mean a different turbo - and those funds might go to fixing the head sealing. Need to review fueling too (can't see the original post while writing here) ) - 1300s sound small for 600 . . .
 

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if there are no receipts to you, you can sue. how do i know this? i got sued and the asshole won, because i had no basic log of anything, because this so called person was actually a friend. this was NJ's law, i am not sure what your laws are. but you probably can sue for damages, especially given that they blew up your perfectly good motor.
 

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in most states a verbal contract is as legally binding as a written one, I'm sure theres documentation somewhere, no shop just does work without logging it as the technicians want to be paid
 
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