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You have as much HP as I do on E85 and supporting mods. Gotta love those Mustang dynos!
Well... ha!!! There may or may not have still been some racefuel left in my tank that day..... haha!! And all the other tunes he has done on his dyno were on our crap alaskan 90 octane pumpgas. My tuner was even impressed with the power my car made that day, and he didnt even get carried away looking for power. It was 20ish hp above what other similar sti's have done on his dyno. His shop is also at prolly 200-300ft of elevation and it was a cold alaskan march morning. But, it is also a dyno, and any number someone gets is subject to objection.. haha! I know my butt dyno is much happier with how it runs now than the way it ran before, and i feel a lot more safe about driving it til i have more supporting mods installed.
 

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Discussion Starter · #42 · (Edited)
Back from the tune! Here's a graph I did on a 3rd gear pull after temps had cooled down into the mid 60s. On the Dynojet I pulled 289 in 91 degrees and some wastegate settings that were off and may or may not have affected the power.

I added in injector duty cycle for the fun of it. :)




 

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Back from the tune! Here's a graph I did on a 3rd gear pull after temps had cooled down into the mid 60s. On the Dynojet I pulled 289 in 91 degrees and some wastegate settings that were off and may or may not have affected the power.

I added in injector duty cycle for the fun of it. :)
Nothing attached.
 

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Glad I found this thread. Been contemplating about installing a Cobb DP but everyone (on forums) says fuel upgrades are required if mated with the SF intake (currently installed).

I called Cobb Plano themselves regarding installing a DP and protune and not once did the tech say anything about fuel upgrades when I was on the phone with him.
 

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Discussion Starter · #46 ·
Glad I found this thread. Been contemplating about installing a Cobb DP but everyone (on forums) says fuel upgrades are required if mated with the SF intake (currently installed).

I called Cobb Plano themselves regarding installing a DP and protune and not once did the tech say anything about fuel upgrades when I was on the phone with him.
Everyone has their preference and comfort level.

Headroom is never a bad thing. You don't see professionals install anything, be it power supplies for manufacturing machines, or injectors for races cars, at 100%+ duty cycles. You can debate until you're blue in the face but if in fact the injector duty cycle is maxing out it's not anything to feel good about.

:)
 

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Everyone has their preference and comfort level.

Headroom is never a bad thing. You don't see professionals install anything, be it power supplies for manufacturing machines, or injectors for races cars, at 100+ duty cycles. You can debate until you're blue in the face but if in fact the injector duty cycle is maxing out it's not anything to feel good about.

:)
I totally agree. Better to be safe than sorry.

I planned on staying stage 1+ but feel like I would be happier at stage 2 with a DP but I didn't want to get rid of my intake and sell it for a loss. Add in the fact that I would have to get injectors would further lighten my wallet. Looks like theres been success without fuel upgrades but is that a fire I'm willing to play with? lol

Or stay stage 1+and get a nice tune from BrenTuning.
 

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Glad I found this thread. Been contemplating about installing a Cobb DP but everyone (on forums) says fuel upgrades are required if mated with the SF intake (currently installed).

I called Cobb Plano themselves regarding installing a DP and protune and not once did the tech say anything about fuel upgrades when I was on the phone with him.
Cobb Plano (when it was still Cobb Plano) did my DP and protune, and larger injectors was never mentioned and never needed.
 

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Cobb Plano (when it was still Cobb Plano) did my DP and protune, and larger injectors was never mentioned and never needed.
How'd your car run powerwise afterwards? That's exactly what i want to get my car to along with a Nameless axle back (which does nothing, I know).

I don't want to spend anymore money on fueling upgrades if they're not needed because I won't go any further powerwise.
 

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Discussion Starter · #50 · (Edited)
Simple solution for you subit.tony ..... monitor your A/F on the and IJC on the AP. You could even do a few pulls in extreme conditions to verify you're good to go.

For me.... it's just not in my comfort zone. I push a lot of limits, probably far too many, but this is one that just didn't feel right to me. It's all about not running too lean. Maxing out the main component that prevents you from running lean?

Why take a chance? That's how I feel anyways. (bonus points for naming what movie that line is from?)

Let us know what you decide to do once you've done it!
 

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How'd your car run powerwise afterwards? That's exactly what i want to get my car to along with a Nameless axle back (which does nothing, I know).

I don't want to spend anymore money on fueling upgrades if they're not needed because I won't go any further powerwise.
It ran great - such a huge difference over stock. The only upgrade that made it seem a little anemic was E85.
 

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Cobb Plano (when it was still Cobb Plano) did my DP and protune, and larger injectors was never mentioned and never needed.
I realize that they were never mentioned and never needed. But do you know or remember what your IDC was running at, when at full wide open throttle? My car originally had the stage 2+ cobb ots tune on it but the access port was missing soo i never got to see what the injectors were cycling at with that tune. Cobb also always said that fuel upgrades were not needed, but obviously that tune is now mia from cobb with them saying it now needs fuel upgrades. But with the stage2+ parts and my protune, i hit 100% duty cycle only when wide full open on a strong pull. I plan to add the fuel upgrades for extra safety, and because it will eventually be getting done anyway with other mods. Haha! It would be nice if we had a e85 option in ak. Know anyone that has experience with water/meth injection?
 

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I realize that they were never mentioned and never needed. But do you know or remember what your IDC was running at, when at full wide open throttle? My car originally had the stage 2+ cobb ots tune on it but the access port was missing soo i never got to see what the injectors were cycling at with that tune. Cobb also always said that fuel upgrades were not needed, but obviously that tune is now mia from cobb with them saying it now needs fuel upgrades. But with the stage2+ parts and my protune, i hit 100% duty cycle only when wide full open on a strong pull. I plan to add the fuel upgrades for extra safety, and because it will eventually be getting done anyway with other mods. Haha! It would be nice if we had a e85 option in ak. Know anyone that has experience with water/meth injection?
Meth water injection will save you some fuel because the meth/water will enrichen the mixture so you can reduce the amount of fuel used. Plus the knock deterrent property and higher octane of the WMI will allow you to make more power and run leaner AFRs.
 

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I realize that they were never mentioned and never needed. But do you know or remember what your IDC was running at, when at full wide open throttle? My car originally had the stage 2+ cobb ots tune on it but the access port was missing soo i never got to see what the injectors were cycling at with that tune. Cobb also always said that fuel upgrades were not needed, but obviously that tune is now mia from cobb with them saying it now needs fuel upgrades. But with the stage2+ parts and my protune, i hit 100% duty cycle only when wide full open on a strong pull. I plan to add the fuel upgrades for extra safety, and because it will eventually be getting done anyway with other mods. Haha! It would be nice if we had a e85 option in ak. Know anyone that has experience with water/meth injection?
Stage 2 + AEM COBB OTS tune: WOT, I was running at 90% IDC peak 19psi, tapering down to redline to 99% IDC 17psi.

Stage 2 + AEM BrenTuning e-tune: WOT, I was running 80% IDC peak 19.5psi, I held peak a little longer on this tune, but tapering down to redline to 103% IDC 15psi. I was over 100% between 5800rpm and 6000rpm for a total of 2secs, repeated through three runs.

The only difference between the two is that the e-tune has an EBCS. Keep in mind, this is with crappy Canadian 91 octane. And...thanks to ShinjiTuned and Shinji alone two years later, I was running a bad MAF all along...gg. :crying:

Fast forward to the rebuild, now I'm running at 54% IDC for just a little bit more power. The 91 octane being my limitation, then headers and turbo.

Follow Shinji's advice, and follow COBB's advice BEFORE they started selling their branded fueling upgrade kits, fueling upgrades are NOT required if tuned properly.
 

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Simple solution for you subit.tony ..... monitor your A/F on the and IJC on the AP. You could even do a few pulls in extreme conditions to verify you're good to go.

For me.... it's just not in my comfort zone. I push a lot of limits, probably far too many, but this is one that just didn't feel right to me. It's all about not running too lean. Maxing out the main component that prevents you from running lean?

Why take a chance? That's how I feel anyways. (bonus points for naming what movie that line is from?)

Let us know what you decide to do once you've done it!
I hear you. I'll probably end up going that route and report back on my readings. Did you mean monitor IDC after DP is installed?
 

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Stage 2 + AEM COBB OTS tune: WOT, I was running at 90% IDC peak 19psi, tapering down to redline to 99% IDC 17psi.

Stage 2 + AEM BrenTuning e-tune: WOT, I was running 80% IDC peak 19.5psi, I held peak a little longer on this tune, but tapering down to redline to 103% IDC 15psi. I was over 100% between 5800rpm and 6000rpm for a total of 2secs, repeated through three runs.

The only difference between the two is that the e-tune has an EBCS. Keep in mind, this is with crappy Canadian 91 octane. And...thanks to ShinjiTuned and Shinji alone two years later, I was running a bad MAF all along...gg. :crying:

Fast forward to the rebuild, now I'm running at 54% IDC for just a little bit more power. The 91 octane being my limitation, then headers and turbo.

Follow Shinji's advice, and follow COBB's advice BEFORE they started selling their branded fueling upgrade kits, fueling upgrades are NOT required if tuned properly.
Good point - Cobb seems to be known for recommending components they sell, and not recommending components they don't sell. They told me several times the Killer B ELH are a waste of money, and guess what - they don't sell ELHs. If they came out with their own brand of ELH, then they would be the greatest thing since sliced bread and much needed.
 

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I did not do any fuel upgrades, but I still have factory intake (soundtube and jug delete) with a drop in panel filter... I don't have a generic "stage" setup though.

Only reason I considered doing full fuel setup was for going e85, but then I'd exceed my factory clutch (and I'm out of budget for the season!)


I'm surprised you didn't add the fuel stumble fix lines.
 

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I'll try and remember to post back with my own update after July.29th when I go in for my protune..

I'll be running:
Cobb AP, Cobb catted dp, Cobb turbo heat shield, Cobb SF intake & box, Perrin lightweight crank pulley, Grimmspeed 3port EBCS, Cobb fuel pressure regulator and relocation kit, Deatshwerks DW65c fuel pump
(I'm doing the fuel pump, because well I already had it and figured if it helps, it helps, if not no harm that's for sure!)
 
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