[Graylens]

Greetings gentlemen, I'm having a bad day. Some friends were driving my 2012 Subaru STI back from the Grand Canyon today and have apparently thrown a rod. My car is lightly modded, a Cobb Cold Air Intake, Invidia Cat Back Quad Exhaust. DynoComp of Scottsdale, AZ did a stage 1 tune and we were at 350 hp/330 ft-lb torque on their dynameter. Tune was done 1/22/20 at 55412 miles. Oil was changed on 7/23/20 at 60577 miles with Mobil 1 Synthetic, oil level was checked via dipstick last Wednesday 9/30. The car has about 63k miles on it, about 8000 miles on the tune.

The mechanics are saying there was no oil in the engine when it arrived at their shop. My friends said there was no warning at all before the rod threw. How could this happen? Shouldn't an oil level light first light, following by a RED oil temp light before the engine grenaded itself? How did that much oil consumption happen in a week?

I'm two years and about 3k miles outside Subaru's powertrain warranty, I believe. I've read some threads on these forums, but is there any hope SOA would step up on this?

Any suggestions on where to find an EJ-25 engine, as there are none in the state of Arizona according to the mechanic?

Do I need to download the tune to my Cobb Accessport before the engine work gets done? Isn't that all in the ECU and will be unaffected by the engine swap?

 

[blckholehurican]

lol no chance subaru is going to do anything. that car is more like 5 years out of warranty and its been modified. on my 2016 they sent me a letter stating they would offer an extended warranty on my shortblock and had about 50 mods listed that voided the warranty entirely. the shop you listed has packages with 100hp gains without an AOS. you basically need an AOS with any tune change and since that company cant even recommend an aftermarket shortblock such as an IAG, they probably dont know anything about subarus and thats probably why your car blew up. take it to a subaru specialist and have them sort your car out.

 

[mheyman]

you basically need an AOS with any tune change

Uh, no. While an a AOS is a benefits in many, even most flat engines, it is not necessary for most stock cars being driven easily. In this case it is possible that having one might have prevented the no oil situation. I don't think we tell from the information provided so far. Could be many things.

OP: With the mods you describe, there is no way your car was at the power level you claim - and if somehow it were then you are lucky it ran for any length of time. I would stay away from the shop that tried or told you that. My guess is that . . . nah not going there. To little info. Check your oil every fill up? That's what "we" tell people here.

Was this car part of lawsuit settlement? Is that why you (OP) you think you might get work done under warranty. Good luck?

 

[Jedi03]

if you change your direction i have an extra engine sitting on a pallet...

 

[Graylens]

Dyno-Comp (DynoComp | World Class Dynamometer Tuning and Sports Car Development) is considered the best tuner shop in Arizona for Subaru’s, and is independently considered one of the top 20 shops in the United States. However, I will be talking to them once we find out more.

Jedi03, contact me with your circumstance, specs, price, and shipping to Flagstaff. Do you offer any warranty?

 

[Leemanfor]

Also, STis do not come with an oil temp sensor nor do they come with an adequate oil pressure sensor. The oil pressure sensor is basically a "change engine" light, as it comes on when it detects LESS than 2.1 psi oil pressure.

An AOS Would not have solved this problem, as it sounds like it was driven pretty hard and likely consumed the oil.

Also, you said you changed the oil with mobil 1? Was it 5w-30? These cars do not like 5w-30 when any mods are thrown at it, and you should upgrade to a solid 40w in the future.

 

[blckholehurican]

Uh, no.

we all

Uh, no. While an a AOS is a benefits in many, even most flat engines, it is not necessary for most stock cars being driven easily.
Was this car part of lawsuit settlement? Is that why you (OP) you think you might get work done under warranty. Good luck?

i Just told you about a lawsuit extended warranty for an engine and how it’s Instantly voided with mods, but you still insist... and the.you go on to say an aos isn’t needed for a car pushing 350 whp with an intake and a tune? Um No.

 

[blckholehurican]

Dyno-Comp (DynoComp | World Class Dynamometer Tuning and Sports Car Development) is considered the best tuner shop in Arizona for Subaru’s, and is independently considered one of the top 20 shops in the United States. However, I will be talking to them once we find out more.

wowie they paid Money to a company to rate them and they got top 20 in the country. whoop de doo. they pushed an intake and a tune to 350 whp... it blew up 8000 miles Later. So Shocking. they Must be the best shop in the world and it’s Subaru’s fault huh.

 

[CTSparky]

Also, STis do not come with an oil temp sensor nor do they come with an adequate oil pressure sensor. The oil pressure sensor is basically a "change engine" light, as it comes on when it detects LESS than 2.1 psi oil pressure.

An AOS Would not have solved this problem, as it sounds like it was driven pretty hard and likely consumed the oil.

Also, you said you changed the oil with mobil 1? Was it 5w-30? These cars do not like 5w-30 when any mods are thrown at it, and you should upgrade to a solid 40w in the future.

I agree with the above. there is no oil temp light and the oil pressure light is triggered at too low a pressure.

Hence why putting in an aftermarket temp and oil pressure gauge is good preventative maintenance or at least an indicator of failure.

I also agree with black huracan that the numbers you suggest from them are WAY too high. Either they are bullshiting you or tuned the engine in kill mode. Even a dyno jet won't read that high for basically a stage 1 tune.

I an also highly suspicious of the top 20 runners in the county. I can name 19 other shops of the top of my head way before this one.

Now these engines are crap. A built engine is an inevitability if you are seriously considering keeping the car.




Sent from my SM-G955U using Tapatalk

 

[Graylens]

Oh, I did forget that when we bought it it had an Invidia High Flow Catted Downpipe. All these mods were in place before we purchased it at AutoNation. We then NEEDED to get a tune because it kept throwing O2 problem codes after a day or two because the previous owner most likely put it back to stock before he sold it. Fortunately, AutoNation did step up and pay for the tune since it would never have passed emissions, and we had no access to the original components.

Dyno-Comp never told me to change the oil weight, not looking for people to sue right now, but this is a well known fact to change the weight of the oil after a tune?

 

[Leemanfor]

Any tuned or hell, stock Ej257/255 should run a 40w oil.

the 30w was required in 2008+ STis/WRXs for Subaru to squeeze out every little bit of MPG and to satisfy emissions requirements.

if you look at the 04-11 STis owners manual Subaru suggests using a 40w oil...and sometimes a 50w, when subject to extreme use IE (racing, stop and go traffic, hot weather, driving up hills)

 

[Jay11STI]

I think you SOL here. These cars a pretty known for oil consumption. Its well documented and suggested here to check oil levels often until you get an idea of consumption rate and if any. The car is moded and past the extended powertrain warranty so i wouldnt expect SOA to step up and pay for an engine at this point. Something like this can happen regardless of an AOS or not. A tune is a big factor when it comes to engine longevity but also the way the car is driven. Driving style and habbits will play big role in all of this too. As for the oil pressure sensor, they are know crap on these cars. If you happen to see that light come on by some chance, its already too late.

 

[yamahaSHO]

You threw a rod or spun a bearing? I'm guessing the latter?

The oil you ran was a resource conserving oil... It breaks down quickly. As already stated, I'd run 5w40 regardless of what Subaru says.

I can't say I've really heard if that shop, especially concerning Subarus, and I am a Subaru tuner (also an AZ resident)... I'd personally stop throwing "best" around.

There are a lot of what-if situations here, but it sounds like it didn't have oil. It is either the oil selection burned up, or something like a ring land caused additional consumption... Or a combination of both

 

[Jay11STI]

You threw a rod or spun a bearing? I'm guessing the latter?

The oil you ran was a resource conserving oil... It breaks down quickly. As already stated, I'd run 5w40 regardless of what Subaru says.

I can't say I've really heard if that shop, especially concerning Subarus, and I am a Subaru tuner (also an AZ resident)... I'd personally stop throwing "best" around.

There are a lot of what-if situations here, but it sounds like it didn't have oil. It is either the oil selection burned up, or something like a ring land caused additional consumption... Or a combination of both

Pretty much hit the nail on the head there. This could of been a combination of ringlands, oil, and or both. We also dont know if this was a pre existing condition prior to purchase. Either way, the car is going to need an engine unfortunately. I think at this point you need to decide if you want to keep the car and invest into or get rid of it. Do your research, there is alot of info on here about short blocks and stuff like that. IAG and many other shops sell staged forged internal short blocks. I would highly recommend you have 1 shop do the job from start to finish. 1 shop remove, rebuild, assemble, install, and tune.

350whp/330tq is a pretty wild claim for a GR/GV on stage 1

 

[Jamcanman]

Greetings gentlemen, I'm having a bad day. Some friends were driving my 2012 Subaru STI back from the Grand Canyon today and have apparently thrown a rod. My car is lightly modded, a Cobb Cold Air Intake, Invidia Cat Back Quad Exhaust. DynoComp of Scottsdale, AZ did a stage 1 tune and we were at 350 hp/330 ft-lb torque on their dynameter. Tune was done 1/22/20 at 55412 miles. Oil was changed on 7/23/20 at 60577 miles with Mobil 1 Synthetic, oil level was checked via dipstick last Wednesday 9/30. The car has about 63k miles on it, about 8000 miles on the tune.

The mechanics are saying there was no oil in the engine when it arrived at their shop. My friends said there was no warning at all before the rod threw. How could this happen? Shouldn't an oil level light first light, following by a RED oil temp light before the engine grenaded itself? How did that much oil consumption happen in a week?

I'm two years and about 3k miles outside Subaru's powertrain warranty, I believe. I've read some threads on these forums, but is there any hope SOA would step up on this?

Any suggestions on where to find an EJ-25 engine, as there are none in the state of Arizona according to the mechanic?

Do I need to download the tune to my Cobb Accessport before the engine work gets done? Isn't that all in the ECU and will be unaffected by the engine swap?

Are you sure your friends didn't miss a gear at high rpm? A wrong downshift gear selection at high rpm can be an engine killer.

 

[LtningRed08]

That sucks man. My 08 STI spun a bearing at like 50k, so I know the feeling. Was just puttering along at 45mph and heard the rod knock sound. No warning just like you mention. There was very little oil in it when I checked after. I monitored my oil fairly regularly at that point, but not every fill up like I do now. I was lucky enough to have Subaru take care I f it under warranty.

I’m at about 160k miles now and have been running 5W-40 Rotella and doing oil checks at every fill up.

There’s lots of reputable shops out there that could get you set up with a new motor if you want to go that route.

Maybe the 350hp your shop quoted you was supposed to be their estimate of the crank hp? 350 whp definitely sounds like too much for stage 1 or 2 and a tune.

My car does 300whp with at stage 2. I think that’s pretty normal.

Anyway, good luck with your decision. Poopy situation.

 

[nllanos87]

Hey OP.

Had basically the exact same situation you describe, right at 63k myself in SoCal. No hard driving, just oil disappearing into the ether, got a knocking sound while driving home from a day at the beach with my family, topped off with oil when i got home, and then the next day when driving down the high-way and shifting to neutral for a slow down the motor just came to a stop and was seized. Tried to start it up again after rolling out through an off-ramp and I could see the entire engine lurching but not turning over. The #4 rod bearing had completely melted and seized my crank... I hate thinking about this time in my cars life!!! lol...

After having a few options (sell the car to a dealer mechanic for pennies, swap to higher potential block, re-build OEM, move on entirely to something non-subaru) I decided to stay with the shop that has done all my performance work from Day 1 since they should know the car the best and get her back on the road. We discussed a "reliability" build, where re-building the short block and making some oil system improvements along the way would be the best bang for my buck. I wasn't (and am not) in search of more power, just would like to have my subie be bullet-proof from the oil starvation. So, we added a killer bee oil pickup system, new oil pain (larger I think), air-oil-separator (as has been mentioned in this thread before), upgraded pistons (again for durability), etc. Regular checking of oil level is always valuable, I learned that the hard way...

If you'd like a detailed list of what I did for the rebuild let me know and I'll go grab the actual shop files and share them with you.

My 2010 Special Edition STI was built roughly the same as you (AEM cold air intake, Invidia catless downpipe, Subaru SPT cat-back exhaust, stage 1 tune by YimiSport in Santa Clarita, CA).

Total out the door was around $7K, and give that my subie was in excellent shape otherwise (paint, body, interior, suspension, etc.) it felt wrong just cutting her loose. This is my first car bought from the dealer, first owner, and have spent way too many hours on it myself to just say goodbye. Maybe you feel the same way, the $7k was a bitter pill to swallow, but in the end I'm happy with my decision to improve reliability rather than get tempted and use the "opportunity" to build-up for power or anything else like that...

 

[killerbmotorsport]

^ very common. With our own products, more and more we're seeing 'reliability based' builds with a few changes to internals (pistons/rods) and a bunch of bolt-ons to improve the longevity probability. I see it as extreme in some instances, but can totally understand (having been there myself a bunch of times), after having to fork out the costs for rebuilding an EJ. They are not inexpensive engines to build/rebuild.

 

[mheyman]

more and more we're seeing 'reliability based' builds with a few changes to internals (pistons/rods) and a bunch of bolt-ons to improve the longevity probability. I see it as extreme in some instances, but can totally understand (having been there myself a bunch of times)

Two questions:

1) After Oil pickup AOS, header, and SB is there anything else you would replace for reliability at or near stock power level on a newish car?
(obviously we might add radiator and hoses to older cars)

asking for a friend

2) If going through the trouble of replacing a SB for reliability, do you feel that a moderate build, say under 400AWHP will significantly reduce reliability - if the parts you recommend were used?

 

[killerbmotorsport]

1) I personally would do the baffle too, just because it's a fairly inexpensive part, and you already go through all the work to get to it when you replace the oil pickup. We've been doing the Get-A-Dom-Tune Cyl 4 cooling mod as well on all of our cars. Since oiling condition is fairly critical when it comes to spinning bearings on these cars, an oil temp gauge is pretty high up on the priority list for me as we well. That's about the extent I would go, but most others also add our pan to the mix as well. It's less of a must have mod, but we all know that having more oil available means the oil condition will be better for a longer period of time and under more sever conditions. Our water pump inlet is not something we recommend for casual street users, but again, people get it because it's another part that improves function over stock.

2) Each of those parts plays a role in improving the probability of longevity. 400whp with good fuel, tune, and supporting mods it can be made very reliable, but keep in mind that is subjective. I wouldn't expect 100K miles, but it built right I would expect a lot, and more importantly, for it not to end catastrophically.