Any blown motors on Cobb Stage 2 OTS map? If no problems, how long on stage 2?

roninsoldier83 · Mar 31, 2008

These are just a few quick questions, pertaining specifically to people running Cobb's Off-the-shelf Stage 2 map... If you've blown a motor using one of their OTS Stage maps, please speak up, and mention what all mods you have on the car, to include specific exhaust setups, if exhaust was catted or not catted, if you're running any sort of intake or upgraded intercooler ect ect.

Also, what octane fuel were you running? What altitude you're at and what version of the map you were running?

If you've been running a Cobb Stage 2 map, and have had no problems, also, post how long you have been running Stage 2, what specific mods are you running, altitude, octane ect?? How many miles on the car and miles since you flashed stage 2?

To anyone who has a wideband, or who has had their car strapped to a dyno with a wideband, what kind of AFR's are you seeing? With just the OTS Stage 2 map, not what AFR's you're running after a Protune lol. These questions are specifically for people with a Cobb Accessport running their OTS "stage" maps, not to include custom tunes, Ecutek, or Open Source flashes ect.

Any information would be greatly appreciated, thank you

LSE · Mar 31, 2008

well, from what I've searched read and know about the OTS stg 2 map is that it is a safe map running on the rich side. These are a few common sense things you should do:

Read the instructions (from their site):
you may run their uppipe or equivalent (not req)
you may run a lighweight main pulley (not req)
drop in (stock replacement) high flow air filter ok (not required)
one step colder plugs ok (not required)
NO TMIC upgrade, NO FMIC upgrade
use the octane the map calls for or higher. E10 and ACN maps are there for a reason.
only use the HWG and LWG maps if you have issues.
run it with a full TBE

some people have posted results showing how the injectors are maxed on a stg2 setup. this may be (or not) the case for you. datalog and find out.

Sorry I can't post stats since I haven't had this map for long. I only plan to use it for a few months before getting protuned with upgrades beyond the tbe.

if you find somebody running stupid crap that they shouldn't. yeah blow up will ya.

roninsoldier83 · Mar 31, 2008

Thanks for the input, I'm pretty aware of their recommendations, but I also know, no 2 cars are necessarily the same. I have the same plan, will be picking up a catted TXS Stealthback pretty soon, flashing to stage 2, and protuning within a month or 2 after.

I'm curious because I'm sure different people at different altitudes (I'm in Colorado, at 5200 ft), with mildly different setups, driving different cars, will likely have different results. I'm trying to gauge the "scope of possibility" lol. On a local Dyno Dynamics, I've seen bone stock STI's put down as low as 207whp and as high as 237whp, with a factory tune, some running much richer/leaner than others. Just wondering what kind of results and variances people are seeing with Cobb's OTS maps for reference.

Also, since I don't plan on running Cobb's specific TBE, just wondering what kind of results other people are having with other exhaust setups (TXS, APS, Helix, Invidia ect), and of course there will always be people that insist on running intakes... would like to put together some info, if several people have blown motors, but all of them had parts they weren't supposed to be running, well, you see where I'm going with this.

Although, any input is greatly appreciated

nhat · Mar 31, 2008

roninsoldier83 said:
I'm curious because I'm sure different people at different altitudes (I'm in Colorado, at 5200 ft), with mildly different setups, driving different cars, will likely have different results. I'm trying to gauge the "scope of possibility" lol. On a local Dyno Dynamics, I've seen bone stock STI's put down as low as 207whp and as high as 237whp, with a factory tune, some running much richer/leaner than others. Just wondering what kind of results and variances people are seeing with Cobb's OTS maps for reference.

as high as 237whp stock in denver? that's rather high. whose dyno? super? maybe that's with 1.15 correction?

i say get harvey for a protune so you don't have to worry about ots maps anymore :tup:

one vendor in my area has seen several blown motors with the cobb ots maps. i'm not sure what the circumstances were but they don't approve of the maps as a long-term solution.

roninsoldier83 · Mar 31, 2008

nhat said:
as high as 237whp stock in denver? that's rather high. whose dyno? super? maybe that's with 1.15 correction?

i say get harvey for a protune so you don't have to worry about ots maps anymore :tup:

Yep, that with the 1.15 CF on Super-Rupair's dyno lol, and it's funny because Harvey is actually the guy who will be Protuning my car, but I won't have the funds for a Protune for at least a month after picking up the Stealthback.

roninsoldier83 · Mar 31, 2008

nhat said:
as high as 237whp stock in denver? that's rather high. whose dyno? super? maybe that's with 1.15 correction?

i say get harvey for a protune so you don't have to worry about ots maps anymore :tup:

one vendor in my area has seen several blown motors with the cobb ots maps. i'm not sure what the circumstances were but they don't approve of the maps as a long-term solution.

That's what I'm thinking... as no 2 cars react the same way. What area are you in?

jordanretro1223 · Mar 31, 2008

In order to have a reliable safe setup with the Cobb OTS map I'd suggest just doing the basics the map asks for; a catted TBE, the AP of course and the octane map for you. Theres no need to do anything else if all you're going to do is run stg 2. Now in the future if you want to get a protune of some sort, then I suggest bolting on your other desired parts, i.e. intakes, fuel pumps, bigger TMIC or FMIC etc. the list goes on. Then jump on the dyno.

nhat · Apr 1, 2008

roninsoldier83 said:
Yep, that with the 1.15 CF on Super-Rupair's dyno lol, and it's funny because Harvey is actually the guy who will be Protuning my car, but I won't have the funds for a Protune for at least a month after picking up the Stealthback.

+1 to harvey

cool ass dude. too bad we never met at any pirates meets while i was out there, met a bunch of folks though.

roninsoldier83 said:
That's what I'm thinking... as no 2 cars react the same way. What area are you in?

dc area and it's one of the more reputable shops in the whole country

specialEd · Apr 1, 2008

I replied to your other thread and thought I would give my in put on this one as well. I reflashed my car stage 1 at about 2K miles and stage 2 at about 40K. I now have 45K and haven't experienced any problems not even in sub-zero temps with an aftermarket intake, and I drive very aggressively. People blow motors on stock tunes with no mods.

I think it's part luck and part driver. especially at a higher elevation your car will typically run more rich because of less air density. I would be worried at a lower elevation in lower temps because of air density.

I wouldn't worry too much about it COBB makes these OTS maps to work on a number of years at virtually all elevations in a variety of temperatures. also the ECU naturally has some flexibility to regulate AFR's

I hope my opinion has been helpful, but a lot of it is just the risk you assume when you mod your car

bhp808 · Apr 1, 2008

i brought my aps tbe catless asp 65mm intake and ap v2 on my car since i had 10k on it and have been running stage 2 pretty hard. i now have 27k on it with no problems but lately i have been hearing an extra whine when shifting and i hope its just me but i guess i got used to stage 2 and it doesnt seem as fast so i got a 255l fuel pump, aps fmic, up-pipe and a protune on deck. So to answer your question i live in sd, cali and ran stage 2 91 oct for about 17k w no problems yet but i do want to figure out what that light whining noise is that comes an goes?

Any indicators on how to know if your turbo is cracked or if something is wrong bc that noise is not always there but it is there and i never noticed it before a couple weeks ago? let me know and i hope my info helps you :tup:

roninsoldier83 · Apr 1, 2008

Good info guys, keep it coming

NewShockerGuy · Apr 2, 2008

I am running the Stg2 off the shelf map via my accessport. Did so for about a year and now about every week I get a CEL p0304. 4th Cylinder missfire detect. I took it to the dealer and they confirmed that my car is in fact not missfiring. It is throwing timing at idle and I think that's what is causing it but it's very annoying. I've had a catless TBE on the car for at least 2 1/2 years, perrin lighten crank pulley (not underdriven) I freaking baby my car.

Got the first CEL today... yay for spring!

I want to get a protune but honestly I don't want to drop that money if I am continuing to get a CEL... if I knew for sure the CEL would be gone and STFO then I would be down...

But honestly from my experience I didn't really notice a power difference going from stock to a stage 2...

But that's me..

-Nigel

roninsoldier83 · Apr 2, 2008

NewShockerGuy said:
I am running the Stg2 off the shelf map via my accessport. Did so for about a year and now about every week I get a CEL p0304. 4th Cylinder missfire detect. I took it to the dealer and they confirmed that my car is in fact not missfiring. It is throwing timing at idle and I think that's what is causing it but it's very annoying. I've had a catless TBE on the car for at least 2 1/2 years, perrin lighten crank pulley (not underdriven) I freaking baby my car.

Got the first CEL today... yay for spring!

I want to get a protune but honestly I don't want to drop that money if I am continuing to get a CEL... if I knew for sure the CEL would be gone and STFO then I would be down...

But honestly from my experience I didn't really notice a power difference going from stock to a stage 2...

But that's me..

-Nigel

Thanks for the insight Nigel

You know, I actually had a misfire code on cylinder #4 in my old '04 WRX when I was running a VF34... which started happening shortly after the car experienced a short episode of audible detonation.... as it turns out, a compression test revealed cyl #4 was about 50psi low, and a tear down revealed a cracked ringland on cyl #4. Had a good buddy of mine named Luke that had the exact same code, exact same problem on his '02 bugeye...

Most people say they feel a significant difference between stock and stage 2, if you're not feeling a difference at all, maybe you're a little down in power? Hopefully it's just a tuning issue, but me personally, I would at least get a compression test done, to make sure the motor is alright. On my WRX, I lost a bit of power, but it was still drivable, and still fairly quick, just not as quick as it should be, but started and drove just fine.

Not judging, just asking, how long did you drive the car with a TBE and no tuning? Might have been a bit of damage there... I would get a compression test, or put the car back to stock and see if it goes away. Either way, thanks for the insight.

NewShockerGuy · Apr 2, 2008

roninsoldier83 said:
Thanks for the insight Nigel

You know, I actually had a misfire code on cylinder #4 in my old '04 WRX when I was running a VF34... which started happening shortly after the car experienced a short episode of audible detonation.... as it turns out, a compression test revealed cyl #4 was about 50psi low, and a tear down revealed a cracked ringland on cyl #4. Had a good buddy of mine named Luke that had the exact same code, exact same problem on his '02 bugeye...

Most people say they feel a significant difference between stock and stage 2, if you're not feeling a difference at all, maybe you're a little down in power? Hopefully it's just a tuning issue, but me personally, I would at least get a compression test done, to make sure the motor is alright. On my WRX, I lost a bit of power, but it was still drivable, and still fairly quick, just not as quick as it should be, but started and drove just fine.

Not judging, just asking, how long did you drive the car with a TBE and no tuning? Might have been a bit of damage there... I would get a compression test, or put the car back to stock and see if it goes away. Either way, thanks for the insight.

Yea no worries at all,

I would say I drove the car with no EM for about 5-6 months. People will probably laugh but I don't race or beat on my car. I normally shift at 4k rpms...sometimes sooner.. I think I can count on my hand how many times I have actually taken the car to say 5500rpms... I don't redline it ever. I've never had it hit the rev limiter, I never launched the car or peel out..lol So in all terms speaking I am pretty gentle with it (or boring I guess depending on who you talk to)

What you said strikes me.
"experienced a short episode of audible detonation" What does this sound like?
Is it a "pinging noise" or is it a "popping" noice

Yea I honestly just want the problem fixed IF there is a problem fixed..lol
If you don't mind me asking how much did that cost you and or what do you think it would cost from the dealer to get replaced..?

-Nigel

roninsoldier83 · Apr 2, 2008

NewShockerGuy said:
Yea no worries at all,

I would say I drove the car with no EM for about 5-6 months. People will probably laugh but I don't race or beat on my car. I normally shift at 4k rpms...sometimes sooner.. I think I can count on my hand how many times I have actually taken the car to say 5500rpms... I don't redline it ever. I've never had it hit the rev limiter, I never launched the car or peel out..lol So in all terms speaking I am pretty gentle with it (or boring I guess depending on who you talk to)

What you said strikes me.
"experienced a short episode of audible detonation" What does this sound like?
Is it a "pinging noise" or is it a "popping" noice

Yea I honestly just want the problem fixed IF there is a problem fixed..lol
If you don't mind me asking how much did that cost you and or what do you think it would cost from the dealer to get replaced..?

-Nigel

The audible detonation sounded just like shaking up BB's in a can. Heard it while getting on it one night (radio off, windows down), only for a couple of seconds, scared the s*** out of me lol. I got off it, but it was too late, got a CEL while driving the next day, misfire on cylinder #4... 50psi low, cracked ringland.

The car had been Ecutek dyno tuned (MZM in Austin, TX), and my AFR's were very safe, between 10.8-11.2:1 on 93 octane (at my request). Installed just about everything myself (VF34, TBE, TMIC, FP ect), except for a couple things... I had a Subaru dealership install a gearset in the tranny, as I didn't have a gearpress, and while the car was there, I had them install the injectors as well, because I didn't want to deal with the hassle. What we found out later, was that the car ran lean because the Fuel Pressure Regulator hose slipped off the manifold under about 20psi of boost... I didn't touch the FPR hose... the Subaru dealership did when they installed my injectors, and they didn't tighten it back down.

My tuner (Muhammad at MZM) called the dealer and explained to them what the problem was and what caused it. I was good friends with a Master Tech that worked there (at the Subaru dealer), and even though the car was modded, knowing their mistake caused it, they actually got it covered under warranty for me. I was told, that the work warranty covered would have cost me around $1800 or so, but I don't remember what their labor rates were, but I remember they were very cheap for a dealer.

If you did in fact have a cracked ringland or something to that effect, and had to have the block pulled, rather than having them put another stock piston in, might as well bore 0.010 over and swap in a set of stronger pistons. Then after the break-in, have the car Protuned to make sure it's running safe, or at least get it on a dyno with a wideband to see how your AFR's look to make sure it's safe. Either way, compression tests are cheap, and only take a couple minutes, might as well get one, just so you know for sure. Just my $.02

all4bspinnin · Apr 2, 2008

a local with an 07 sti running a cobb OTS stage 2 map just blew his motor... all he had was intake and full 3 inch exhaust

hence why i still say that the 07 ecu is garbage... the first thing id do on an 07 is get an AEM/Hydra

roninsoldier83 · Apr 2, 2008

all4bspinnin said:
a local with an 07 sti running a cobb OTS stage 2 map just blew his motor... all he had was intake and full 3 inch exhaust

hence why i still say that the 07 ecu is garbage... the first thing id do on an 07 is get an AEM/Hydra

Yeah, I bought my '06 STI when the '07's were still new, considered buying a new '07, but after the horror stories I've read about, I decided to just save some cash and picked up my then 1-yr old '06. What kind of intake was he running?

NewShockerGuy · Apr 2, 2008

roninsoldier83 said:
The audible detonation sounded just like shaking up BB's in a can. Heard it while getting on it one night (radio off, windows down), only for a couple of seconds, scared the s*** out of me lol. I got off it, but it was too late, got a CEL while driving the next day, misfire on cylinder #4... 50psi low, cracked ringland.

The car had been Ecutek dyno tuned (MZM in Austin, TX), and my AFR's were very safe, between 10.8-11.2:1 on 93 octane (at my request). Installed just about everything myself (VF34, TBE, TMIC, FP ect), except for a couple things... I had a Subaru dealership install a gearset in the tranny, as I didn't have a gearpress, and while the car was there, I had them install the injectors as well, because I didn't want to deal with the hassle. What we found out later, was that the car ran lean because the Fuel Pressure Regulator hose slipped off the manifold under about 20psi of boost... I didn't touch the FPR hose... the Subaru dealership did when they installed my injectors, and they didn't tighten it back down.

My tuner (Muhammad at MZM) called the dealer and explained to them what the problem was and what caused it. I was good friends with a Master Tech that worked there (at the Subaru dealer), and even though the car was modded, knowing their mistake caused it, they actually got it covered under warranty for me. I was told, that the work warranty covered would have cost me around $1800 or so, but I don't remember what their labor rates were, but I remember they were very cheap for a dealer.

If you did in fact have a cracked ringland or something to that effect, and had to have the block pulled, rather than having them put another stock piston in, might as well bore 0.010 over and swap in a set of stronger pistons. Then after the break-in, have the car Protuned to make sure it's running safe, or at least get it on a dyno with a wideband to see how your AFR's look to make sure it's safe. Either way, compression tests are cheap, and only take a couple minutes, might as well get one, just so you know for sure. Just my $.02

Welp I can honestly say I have never heard that as far as bb's inside of a can... which is good I guess? But there is definatly a problem I think with idleing and the timing. When I took it to the dealer last summer they were confident that the plugs, coilpacks were good because they pulled them out and checked for me. It's just that darn idle....idlle "pop, pop"...idle....pop, pop...poppop...etc..

I don't want to stray toooo off topic..
This might not be related but when I installed my TBE years ago after that there has always been a smell of "oil" When I drive up to a stop light and sit I smell it. There are no leaks under the car and when I pull of the intercooler there is just MINOR blowback oil that resides in the incooler main air port...I do have a perrin catch can but the oil smell is still there. When you stand behind the car you obviously smell the catless exhaust..lol But inside the cabin you do smell an oil smell...

Just a little frustrating to me that's all since I baby the car and don't abuse it yet I get a CEL..lol Makes me think I should have only done exterior mods... :-(
-Nigel

specialEd · Apr 3, 2008

I guess it's really just luck because i've really beat on my car. I've launched it countless times and I take it to redline on a regular basis. But I had a similar experience as Ronin with my '02 because I was new to tuning and I ran a turboback without EM, had detonation and lost compression on #3 and #4

From this experience I learned that EM is critical to the health of your car if you make the proper mods you don't have to baby your car you can drive it however you want and it should be reliable

If you make the correct mods you can rest assured that it was a mechanical failure and not a tuning error. Cars aren't bulletproof, **** happens but if you make the correct choices when modifying you take out that margin of error

Peleg · Apr 3, 2008

NewShockerGuy said:
I want to get a protune but honestly I don't want to drop that money if I am continuing to get a CEL...

A protune is going to ensure your car runs right and will most likely fix the CEL unless the dealer doesn't know jack about cars.

Any blown motors on Cobb Stage 2 OTS map? If no problems, how long on stage 2?

roninsoldier83

LSE

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nhat

roninsoldier83

roninsoldier83

jordanretro1223

nhat

specialEd

bhp808

roninsoldier83

NewShockerGuy

roninsoldier83

NewShockerGuy

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all4bspinnin

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