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Old 12-08-17, 07:55 AM   #41
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Default Re: 2.4L DIT boxer

Quote:
Originally Posted by HeatSource View Post
Automatic transmissions are the future. Manuals will diminish slowly and the ones kept around will basically be for the novelty of having one. Don’t get me wrong, I love rowing through my gears

There was never a question of whats faster, the point is what is more enjoyable to the consumer... If Subaru does away with the MT and goes electric assist, I'm out, and the only "new" Subaru for me will be a clean 03' wrx next year.

I sincerely hope they revamp the motor in the sti, make 40-50 more hp/tq, give it direct injection, and get at least 27hwy mpg. If they do, I'll be the first to buy a new sti in March 2018/2019 depending on when they come out.
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Old 12-08-17, 11:38 AM   #42
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Default Re: 2.4L DIT boxer

A lot of manuals are gone not only because of supposed decreased demand / DCT are faster, etc...but in AMGs and other mega HP models they're saying they can only put that much power down through an automatic. Haha maybe Kia Stinger is the wave of the past and the future w the slushbox. Anyway the STI will never have enough power to need an auto for that reason.

I can appreciate DSG/DCT, I get why the forester xt and other cars have pseudosports cvt, I get the point of performance hybrids...I'm still not into any of that. I don't care how fast it is, how smooth it is, or even something like if I can get more HP for my dollar. If the STI gets any of that ill understand from a business perspective, but I'm definitely out too. I'll buy a product I can live with groom a brand I don't like before I'll buy something I never asked for.
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Old 12-09-17, 08:17 AM   #43
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Default Re: 2.4L DIT boxer

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Originally Posted by murfnamedsmurf View Post
A lot of manuals are gone not only because of supposed decreased demand / DCT are faster, etc...but in AMGs and other mega HP models they're saying they can only put that much power down through an automatic.
mercedes pretty much never had manual transmission, especially on their AMG line.
but BMW did, m5 v10, m3 v8, and i believe the current M3/M4 still come in manual gearbox...

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Old 12-09-17, 08:22 AM   #44
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Default Re: 2.4L DIT boxer

Yeah valid point, AMG were always serving a niche of their own ala ball crushingly fast luxury. They never really had interest in the "sport" market. Even so, I don't recall the specifics but some manufacturers did indicate the insane power levels make it hard to offer a reliable stick shift.

Personally, ill take a well balanced car w intermediate power levels and a stick.
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Old 12-09-17, 02:33 PM   #45
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Default Re: 2.4L DIT boxer

Quote:
Originally Posted by BEOFGOD View Post
2013 Honda CR-Z EX 6-Speed Manual Transmission Test Drive - YouTube
2.4L DIT boxer 2013 Honda CR-Z EX 6-Speed Manual Transmission Test Drive ...


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I am well aware manual transmission gasoline-electric hybrids exist.

The sole two are the 1st generation Honda Insight and the Honda CR-Z. Nobody else has the balls to even try that.

Subaru, with its limited budget and market, will almost certainly NEVER make a manual-transmission gasoline-electric hybrid that would retain mechanical AWD. Gone are the days when you could buy any Subaru with an EJ255/EJ205 in any vehicle of the lineup, those days of niche-vehicle production are dead, sadly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by maverickar15 View Post
Really hoping at least 330 stable HP from the 2.4L with 3300 lbs weight limit, or lighten the car to keep under 10 lb / hp ratio.

If STI loses mechanical AWD with manual, that also likely be the end of Subaru for me. I drove my wife's Forester XT CVT for a while and yes I appreciate the combination of silky-smoothness and relative quickness but it is just not for me. I don't care about 0-60 times on DCT type transmission. Rev-match synchro thing is fine as long as I can turn it completely off, and not like BMW M2 where I also have to turn traction control off

The problem is there is almost no one else that offers this AWD/MT combination. VW Golf R and Sportswagen 4motion 6MT are the only ones that come up to my mind, but I'm not sure about the reliability. Impreza & XV, while nice, don't do it for me since they are too slow.
There's also the Jeep Renegade with the 6-speed manual and 1.4L turbo 4-cylinder available with "4X4" (really just AWD with a stupid 4X4 badge).

The mechanical connection of a true 3-pedal manual transmission cannot be substituted with a DCT. It's just not the same performing one's own perfect heel-toe downshifts into a corner compared to slapping a left paddle to downshift effortlessly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by blacknblue06STI View Post
^^^^I agree. I've been saying for several years that the STI should have a dual clutch Sequential manual transmission version of the current 6 speed as an option...these transmissions shift much faster than people can and allow for more precise powerband output less drop off in power etc etc clutches last longer ....there is zero downside. The car would be 4 seconds flat to 60 if not faster with a dual clutch and faster in the 1/4
  • increased cost of development and production
  • increased complexity increases efforts for diagnosis of problems
  • increased cost of vehicle
  • compared to existing Lineartronic CVT, would not likely be able to outperform fuel-efficiency, thus, would be limited to use in sporty models, which Subaru has very few of
  • increased weight for an already-heavy AWD system
  • unlike conventional manual transmission, clutch(es) and other transmission maintenance may not be servicable to the DIY-er

Quote:
Originally Posted by HeatSource View Post
Automatic transmissions are the future. Manuals will diminish slowly and the ones kept around will basically be for the novelty of having one. Don’t get me wrong, I love rowing through my gears
I'll give them my stick shift when they pry it from my cold dead hands

Quote:
Originally Posted by uschearak View Post
There was never a question of whats faster, the point is what is more enjoyable to the consumer... If Subaru does away with the MT and goes electric assist, I'm out, and the only "new" Subaru for me will be a clean 03' wrx next year.

I sincerely hope they revamp the motor in the sti, make 40-50 more hp/tq, give it direct injection, and get at least 27hwy mpg. If they do, I'll be the first to buy a new sti in March 2018/2019 depending on when they come out.
Though speed is what makes the WRX STI attractive, driving enjoyment is just as important, if not more important.

Revamp, more like, outright completely new is what it needs IMO. I doubt Subaru can continue to milk the EJ engine and comply with emissions and MPG requirements, especially considering the engine family is approaching 3 decades old.
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Old 12-26-17, 04:01 PM   #46
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Default Re: 2.4L DIT boxer

Quote:
Originally Posted by murfnamedsmurf View Post
A lot of manuals are gone not only because of supposed decreased demand / DCT are faster, etc...but in AMGs and other mega HP models they're saying they can only put that much power down through an automatic.
is this the thing? I see tons of high whp builds, some even with stock trannys. The transmission never seems to be the limiting factor. I can see them pushing DCT to padd their 0-60 numbers and mpg, but can a more complicated transmission really support more power?
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Old 12-26-17, 05:04 PM   #47
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Default Re: 2.4L DIT boxer

Manual transmissions can hold torque fine, it just becomes difficult to make them drivable and luxurious because you have to use such a stout clutch at high torque outputs. DCTs get extremely expensive when you put a lot of torque through them though, to build initially and to maintain. They also can't be as compact with the same number of gears as a torque-converter auto. As torque-converter autos get better you're going to see DCT get phased out in anything outside of the select supercars. Audi is already doing it. Quick shifting autos with more gears are more efficient, faster, cheaper, and more compact. As the shifting logic gets better they will start to out-perform DCT on track as well. The 10-speed auto from Ford and GM is phenomenal, especially in the performance configurations. You just can't even keep up shifting that many gears manually though. Leaving it in auto is faster.
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