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S209 Driving Impressions will be out Today...........
S209 Driving Impressions will be out Today...........
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Old 10-15-19, 10:18 AM   #131
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Default Re: S209 Driving Impressions will be out Today...........

Quote:
Originally Posted by ajsti24 View Post
I agree^^ No GM, Mopar or Ford here...cannot compare Subaru WRX-STi with these three or any wannabe's, and i will never buy them, ever. As i said before only WRX-STi vs Lancer Evo(even though discontinued) comparo only the rest are just trying to get a piece of the pie.

And for the haters...Please leave the S209 alone, if you don't like the specs, pricing, features, don't buy it and shut-up. Subaru is not forcing you to buy the S209.



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So you only want positive reactions to everything Subaru does? Let's just change the site name to subaru-circle-jerk.com.


Quote:
Originally Posted by b18c5rjdm View Post
Some of us think the C8 is hideous, and shouldn't even be in a comparison.
Besides that, GM makes utter garbage.
Have you seen any vehicle made by GM that can go a whole year without electrical problems?
Sure they may be fast, but are they gonna get your ass home in a blizzard?
I'm a bit biased, I have 3 Subarus, the only other brands I would ever consider would be Honda or Toyota.
That'll be a fun sentiment to have when a Z51 or ZL1 1LE is lapping you after 5 laps for the same money. PS Chevrolet has less problems per vehicle than Subaru according to JD power

It's not just GM that's an option. M3/M4 is in this same price range, M2 Competition, CLA45, hell C63 isn't far off, RS3 is ten grand cheaper. Many of these cars are faster, have much more modern tech and are wayyyyy nicer. This car is just plain too expensive.

Edit: forgot to include GT350 for the manual purists.

Last edited by 8cd03gro; 10-16-19 at 12:19 PM.
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Old 10-15-19, 05:03 PM   #132
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Default Re: S209 Driving Impressions will be out Today...........

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Originally Posted by raisingAnarchy View Post
Does anyone have details on what STI did with the S209 motors? They weren't assembled on the normal assembly line where a standard EJ257 is assembled, correct? Does that mean that the STI group hand built the motors? Like ensuring proper clearances of the main bearing journals and all that.

If they did take, say Subi-Performance's, approach to building the EJ in the S209, then it might actually be a high quality motor despite the lack of forged piston heads. The biggest issue I've heard about the EJs is the assembly line tolerances, which yield wide ranges in bearing tolerances, ring gaps, etc.

Surely, they didn't just drop forged rods that are in the basic EJ257 right? That must be a typo in true SOA marketing fashion.
It's the standard 19+ STI/Type RA EJ257 block. It has sodium filled exhaust valves like the Type RA in addition to stiffer exhaust valve springs. It's not hand-built and balanced like other S series engines.
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Old 10-15-19, 05:32 PM   #133
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Default Re: S209 Driving Impressions will be out Today...........

I'll preface this with saying that I'm a JDM Subaru/STI enthusiast. I like rare, OEM+ parts with better engineering and design.. and I'm willing to spend more money on that even when there are cheaper aftermarket alternatives.

I think people would have been happier simply with a LHD S208. But we never had a chance of actually getting that.
  • Hand-built & balanced engine with forged pistons
  • Twin scroll ELH
  • Twin scroll, ball bearing turbo with titanium turbine wheel
  • Better torque curve & 8k rpm redline
  • Real Recaro Sportster CS seats
  • Bilstein DampMatic II adjustable suspension
  • 11:1 steering rack
..and so on.

The S208 got all of those extras at a price of $57k (direct conversion). Oh, and a lottery system to prevent ADM. (Yes, I know there are other costs associated with selling the car in the US)

Instead we get a better version of the Type RA with a few S series bits from the STI catalog.. and for more money. I'd consider this more of a Type RA-R. It mostly keeps the standard STI's EJ257 with a ~18G sized single scroll, journal bearing turbo mated to the inefficient UELH.. and tuned for a bit more boost. This is supposed to show the progression of STI performance since the S208.. and symbolize the pinnacle of Subaru & STI engineering. That's simply not the case. It would be better to call it the Type RA-R or EJ251.

The S209 is in an awkward position because it's too expensive and rare to daily drive. It's not a performance bargain. It's not a real track warrior. It'll mostly be left as a collectible/garage queen that may see some car shows. And probably a future on Bring a Trailer.

I wanted to love and want this car. I just don't.. which is fine because others will. I guess we should just be glad that Subaru sent a "S car" to the US. Hopefully we'll get another, better S car in the future.

Last edited by STINick19; 10-16-19 at 06:46 AM. Reason: fixed a typo
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Old 10-15-19, 05:35 PM   #134
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Default Re: S209 Driving Impressions will be out Today...........

I was searching for information about the S208's turbo and stumbled across the build below. This guy partnered with STI to essentially build a prototype for an S series Forester STI.

As many of You may have noticed and many... - Advanced Sports Engineering Lab | Facebook

That's how an S series should be built. I'd pay $60-70k for that

What it would be like to have full access to STI's and Subaru of Japan's parts catalogs.
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Old 10-15-19, 07:02 PM   #135
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https://www.subaru.com/2019-S209
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For the first time ever, you can own the apex STI of engineering.
RESERVE YOURS NOW

*At participating retailers
Yet it's not the apex of Subaru & STI engineering..
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Old 10-16-19, 03:19 AM   #136
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Default Re: S209 Driving Impressions will be out Today...........

Quote:
Originally Posted by STINick19 View Post
I was searching for information about the S208's turbo and stumbled across the build below. This guy partnered with STI to essentially build a prototype for an S series Forester STI.

As many of You may have noticed and many... - Advanced Sports Engineering Lab | Facebook

That's how an S series should be built. I'd pay $60-70k for that

What it would be like to have full access to STI's and Subaru of Japan's parts catalogs.
They are in Italy I believe.

There is a video of that forester revving to 8250rpm - very smoothly. They balanced the crankshaft with the flywheel together.

Pretty damn neat.
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Old 10-16-19, 08:08 AM   #137
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Default Re: S209 Driving Impressions will be out Today...........

Quote:
Originally Posted by STINick19 View Post
The S208 got all of those extras at a price of $57k (direct conversion). Oh, and a lottery system to prevent ADM. (Yes, I know there are other costs associated with selling the car in the US)

Instead we get a better version of the Type RA with a few S series bits from the STI catalog.. and for more money. I'd consider this more of a Type RA-R. It mostly keeps the standard STI's EJ257 with a ~18G sized single scroll, journal bearing turbo mated to the inefficient UELH.. and tuned for a bit more boost. This is supposed to show the progression of STI performance since the S208.. and symbolize the pinnacle of Subaru & STI engineering. That's simply not the case. It would be better to call it the Type RA-R or EJ251.

The S209 is in an awkward position because it's too expensive and rare to daily drive. It's not a performance bargain. It's not a real track warrior. It'll mostly be left as a collectible/garage queen that may see some car shows. And probably a future on Bring a Trailer.

I wanted to love and want this car. I just don't.. which is fine because others will. I guess we should just be glad that Subaru sent a "S car" to the US. Hopefully we'll get another, better S car in the future.
Thanks for the info. That is quite sad, this little bit of bait and switch. Amazing to me how Subaru treats the customers of their most successful market...

Are the Japanese going out in droves and buying CVT shitboxes? You'd think the ultra-limited editions released in USDM wouldn't be bordering on silly given the profits they're likely achieving here.
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Old 10-16-19, 08:31 AM   #138
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Default Re: S209 Driving Impressions will be out Today...........

Quote:
Originally Posted by STINick19 View Post
  • Hand-built & balanced engine with forged pistons
  • Twin scroll ELH
  • Twin scroll, ball bearing turbo with titanium turbine wheel
  • Better torque curve & 8k rpm redline
  • Real Recaro Sportster CS seats
  • Bilstein DampMatic II adjustable suspension
  • 11:1 steering rack
..and so on.

The S208 got all of those extras at a price of $57k (direct conversion). Oh, and a lottery system to prevent ADM. (Yes, I know there are other costs associated with selling the car in the US)
As a follow-up to my own post on the extras that the S208 received and the $57k price tag.. I was interested to find out that the base STI in Japan sells at a similar price to the US version at $36k.
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Old 10-16-19, 09:57 AM   #139
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Default Re: S209 Driving Impressions will be out Today...........

Quote:
Originally Posted by ajsti24 View Post
And for the haters...Please leave the S209 alone, if you don't like the specs, pricing, features, don't buy it and shut-up. Subaru is not forcing you to buy the S209.

There's a meaningful difference between being a "hater" and expecting Subaru to follow through with their own announcement. I own an RA, so it's not like I'm here talking trash without having put my own money where my mouth is. I bought Subaru's best, at the time, and was fully prepared to make the move to an S209; however, despite my own preparations, Subaru didn't follow through and I simply refuse to give them a pass for that.

I don't care if you want people to "shut up", it was people opening their mouths and clamoring for "more" that got us the Type RA (that people love to hate on) and now the S209.

If you stand for nothing you fall for everything; the S209 is a glorified Type RA that starts roughly $15k over the MSRP of a Type RA, there's not $15k worth of changes (don't forget the modest $10-20k ADMs) and that's completely disregarding the fender and bumper not even lining up in their own Twitter photos of the S209.

The people who need to "shut up" are the blind fan boys who think Subaru can do no wrong.
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Old 10-16-19, 10:02 AM   #140
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Default Re: S209 Driving Impressions will be out Today...........

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Originally Posted by TheLastSTI View Post
The people who need to "shut up" are the blind fan boys who think Subaru can do no wrong.
Yes!!!
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