[Turko]

Ok, dumb handling question (still learning to harness the power of the sti). So to rid myself of understeer, i install fts brace, springs, and rear sway. Im ridin on proxes t1-s tires. I take a sharp turn today (in safe conditions) and the car spins out. I'm curious as to what I did wrong. I did apply some gas in the turn but not so much so that it should induce the rear to spin out. Any ideas.

[BoricuaSTi]

You sure it might not have been too much power? I took a corner once (more like a U-turn) with the STi, applied power like I would in my S2000.... ALMOST spun out, but didn't... I let off, almost facing the curve, and was rather embarrased.... it was at the end of a street by my house with no traffic... so no harm to anyone...

[Mainstream]

you should definitely considering getting a front sway for a more balanced turn in...

I'm with Nick on this one - work on your throttle play

[Sands]

To add on what was already stated...

Several possibilities:

1. Too much speed
2. Trail Braked
3. Gas too soon
4. Liftoff oversteer
5. Something funky with the suspension.

Solutions...
1. Slow down a bit. Ideally, you want to creap up in speed until you get to your limits (not the same as the cars limits!)
2. Get your braking done in a straight line prior to turn in. Most cars, when setup properly, will understeer on slower corners and be neutral / oversteer on higher speed corners. The dynamics change with speed. If you trail braked, you will exceed the traction limits of the tires. Google for "traction circle".
3. Power Oversteer. You broke the car loose when you got on the gas. This will also happen if you are in 1st or 2nd and get on sharply. Also depends on how much the car is loaded up in the corner. See traction circle.
4. Got off the gas too fast and upset the balance of the car. Similar to trail braking but generally happend 1/2 way through the corner when the driver's pucker factor kicks in and they get off the gas. If you are not power oversteering, getting off the gas is the worste thing you can do. (Some times when power oversteering, getting on the gas is the right thing to do...)
5. See front sway comments from above or a problem with springs/suspension/struts binding.

Good read on driving smoothness

http://www.windycitybmw.com/articles/smoothness.asp

Oh yeah - take a high performance driving school. Most Audi/BMW/Porsche clubs sponsor them. ~$500 for 2 days is typical.

[donmei]

Dumb question, not kidding: Do you know how to drive fast?? Really, actually get a car to do what you want it to do??

do you have any race track time??

Do you understand force vectors and how accelerating/braking affects a tire's ability to turn?
Do you understand for/aft/left/right weight shift and how it affects understeer/oversteer??

If you didn't answer yes to ALL of those questions, I'd suggest that your first upgrade to "rid myself of understeer" should have been a performance driving school.

Your question, without giving any real specifics suggests that your next upgrade should be to your skills. I'm not flaming you in any way. Its great that you went out and played somewhere safe, hopefully a parking lot or something.

Generally a car will oversteer (spin out in an extreme case) in 2 circumstances:
1) Power on oversteer. Usually in low gears. You are driving the rear wheels so hard that they can't provide any lateral acceleration. When asked to turn AND accelerate, the tire slides. (this is a demonstration of the finite force vectors that a tire can provide this is where that whole force vector thing comes into play

2) Lift throttle oversteer. If you are cornering at or near the limit, the tires are working to turn the car as best they can. If you get on the gas a little bit you will be asking the tire to provide extra traction. This is at least partially ofset by a rearward weight shift. This puts more weight on the rear tire which allows it to provide more force. Even if the back end does break loose, its usually gradual as the extra traction afforded by the rearward weight shift softens things out.

HOWEVER if you are cornering at the limit and instead LIFT off the throttle. The rear tires are now asked to decelerate the car in addition to turning it. This can exceed the traction limits of the tire. Also in a lift throttle situation the weight shifts FORWARD, OFF THE REAR WHEELS. So not only are you introducing a for/aft force to the tire, you are giving it less traction to work with. Next thing you know SNAP.

I haven't been able to get the back end out on my STI, other than in low speed "powerslides", like in example 1.

Another rule of thumb. The end of a vehicle with the greatest roll stiffness will usually slide first. So it should be obvious that installing a stiffer rear anti-roll bar will increase the tendency to snap. You've made the car LESS forgiving of your errors. Is the car faster, yes, with the right driver.

I noticed NHLUHRS is on this thread. He usually finds something (minor) wrong with what I write, so take this with a grain of salt. (he's usually right)

My suggestion is not to track the car the way it is, otherwise you risk backing off the track and really hurting yourself. Switch back to stock and start learning. Learn how to drive the car properly. Most people who b1tch about the car understeering DON'T KNOW HOW TO DRIVE. If they did, they'd adapt to the car. Brake in a straight line (less trail braking) Breathe on the gas as early as possible. Feel the car take a set. Woo hoo, now you're driving. Get as much gas in as early as possible. The STI doesn't like trail braking, but behaves great when its coasting or accelerating. Learn to use that. Don't be one of those ham handed buffoons who cranks into a turn way too fast, jumps on the brakes, then complains that its the CARS FAULT that it understeers.

Once you can handle that, switch back to the aftermarket anti-roll bar. Next step is to learn to use oversteer to go faster. Also, words of wisdom taught to me by my lunatic Accountant vintage racer father (you couldn't pay me to drive a 58 corvette around Limerock)

He said:
Oversteer at 40 mph = FUN
Oversteer at 140 mph = SHEER TERROR

He also said that he's used to not having brakes after the 3rd lap, but thats a whole 'nother thread

Thats why the Nascar boys and the indy boys all shoot for a little "push" (understeer) on the big ovals.


Don

[Snax]

I HIGHLY recommend the matching front bar for your car. Most swaybar sets are balanced in a way that overrides the stock understeer sufficiently, and the car will handle much better overall.