[gOt_rally?]

Well im set on as much grip and neutral feel as possible. At -2 front -1.3 rear with whiteline 24mm frnt set at stiff and 24mm rear set at soft (to prevent lifting rear in auto-x) the car still feels like it pushes too much and I want to run faster times. I only have a budget for one set of tires (gonna run stockers or re01r's) and about 1000 bucks for mods. I figured camber plates/alk/aligment with -3 front and rear maxed out (about -1.75) I would get the performance I want for now untill I can afford coilovers

[Turninconcepts.com]

Originally Posted by gOt_rally?

Well im set on as much grip and neutral feel as possible. At -2 front -1.3 rear with whiteline 24mm frnt set at stiff and 24mm rear set at soft (to prevent lifting rear in auto-x) the car still feels like it pushes too much and I want to run faster times. I only have a budget for one set of tires (gonna run stockers or re01r's) and about 1000 bucks for mods. I figured camber plates/alk/aligment with -3 front and rear maxed out (about -1.75) I would get the performance I want for now untill I can afford coilovers

AH!! Now I understand. You're going the wrong way with the rear camber. You actually want to back the rear camber down to about -1.0 so you can get better rotation.

Remember - our rear setup is a Chapman setup which is basically a MacPherson strut in the rear of the car. So the same rules apply back there. One difference though is you have a much longer lateral link in the rear than you have control arm in the front. Also they have a better angle in the rear so you don't roll over toward positive camber as quickly as you do in the front.

What you're up against is the fact that you're still at stock ride height which is going to make things more difficult for camber. Of plates out there at this time that meet the criteria of both struts and then coilovers later on, will let you get decent camber out of the box, and are reliable I would look at getting the RCE lowering front plates.

Yes, the lowering ones.

As for more caster - look into the free caster mod, and if that's still not enough then you can cant the front plates to allow them to gain some caster.

I would also suggest cutting your front bump stops.

[gOt_rally?]

Originally Posted by Turninconcepts.com

AH!! Now I understand. You're going the wrong way with the rear camber. You actually want to back the rear camber down to about -1.0 so you can get better rotation.

Remember - our rear setup is a Chapman setup which is basically a MacPherson strut in the rear of the car. So the same rules apply back there. One difference though is you have a much longer lateral link in the rear than you have control arm in the front. Also they have a better angle in the rear so you don't roll over toward positive camber as quickly as you do in the front.

What you're up against is the fact that you're still at stock ride height which is going to make things more difficult for camber. Of plates out there at this time that meet the criteria of both struts and then coilovers later on, will let you get decent camber out of the box, and are reliable I would look at getting the RCE lowering front plates.

Yes, the lowering ones.

As for more caster - look into the free caster mod, and if that's still not enough then you can cant the front plates to allow them to gain some caster.

I would also suggest cutting your front bump stops.

Thanks for the great info.

But now you got be thinking "i know i know you prettyy much explained everything"

but if I were to take caster/ and lowering out of the equation

because I can achieve the desired caster through caster mod and ALK

and just wanted to buy plates to achieve maximum camber with plate and bolt would the rce non lowering plate be a better option? Be im prettry set on achieving the max camber as possible to get as much grip as I can out of the setup.

Also regardless of how much camber camber I run in the front how much less camber should i run in the back "if front -2 back -1" that means theres a 1 degree difference

The dilemma i had running less camber in the back was I didnt want the set up to be too loose. From What I have read track set up cars only have a 1 degree difference in camber when the car is set up for track. can I have more of a difference between back and from on a track set up? I also do auto-x but i prefer the set up to be track safe as I dont want my back end wasinh out on a highspeed sweeper.

[Turninconcepts.com]

Originally Posted by gOt_rally?

Thanks for the great info.

But now you got be thinking "i know i know you prettyy much explained everything"

but if I were to take caster/ and lowering out of the equation

because I can achieve the desired caster through caster mod and ALK

and just wanted to buy plates to achieve maximum camber with plate and bolt would the rce non lowering plate be a better option? Be im prettry set on achieving the max camber as possible to get as much grip as I can out of the setup.

Also regardless of how much camber camber I run in the front how much less camber should i run in the back "if front -2 back -1" that means theres a 1 degree difference

The dilemma i had running less camber in the back was I didnt want the set up to be too loose. From What I have read track set up cars only have a 1 degree difference in camber when the car is set up for track. can I have more of a difference between back and from on a track set up? I also do auto-x but i prefer the set up to be track safe as I dont want my back end wasinh out on a highspeed sweeper.

Well, which are you going to do? Track or autoX? I hate to say it, but you're all over the map on this, and from what I can tell you haven't even started the season yet.

I said lowering before, and I'll say it again. Lowering plates.

If you really want to start off in a good stance before you throw any money into camber plates take what you currently have and spend the money on the best tires you can get for it. Go run that THEN start thinking about what needs to be changed.

[gOt_rally?]

Originally Posted by Turninconcepts.com

Well, which are you going to do? Track or autoX? I hate to say it, but you're all over the map on this, and from what I can tell you haven't even started the season yet.

I said lowering before, and I'll say it again. Lowering plates.

If you really want to start off in a good stance before you throw any money into camber plates take what you currently have and spend the money on the best tires you can get for it. Go run that THEN start thinking about what needs to be changed.

Well I do both but I want a setup that is safe for track since a pure auto-x setup is too loose for track.

The reason for being all over the map is

I didnt know alk and free castor mod will give me more than enough caster so that feel out of the equation.

I will spend good money on tires and have run through 2 sets of re07's on my current setup so I am fimiliar with the setup hence why I want to spice things up and change it.

The reason for me asking about the non lowering is because I know you can achieve more camber with them and didnt think that the extra 1cm or so travel gained from the lowering plates is so vital esepcaily since the AST's you guys offer are pomoted as having lots and lots of travel.

Lastly if I can pick you brain one more time, how much camber difference to do recommend for a TRACK setup from front to rear. I know it wont be optimal for auto-x tight corners, but my concern with neutral feel is in track corners not auto'x corners. I know for auto-x setups many run under -1 degree of rear camber and about -3 up front.

[Turninconcepts.com]

Originally Posted by gOt_rally?

Well I do both but I want a setup that is safe for track since a pure auto-x setup is too loose for track.

The reason for being all over the map is

I didnt know alk and free castor mod will give me more than enough caster so that feel out of the equation.

I will spend good money on tires and have run through 2 sets of re07's on my current setup so I am fimiliar with the setup hence why I want to spice things up and change it.

The reason for me asking about the non lowering is because I know you can achieve more camber with them and didnt think that the extra 1cm or so travel gained from the lowering plates is so vital esepcaily since the AST's you guys offer are pomoted as having lots and lots of travel.

Lastly if I can pick you brain one more time, how much camber difference to do recommend for a TRACK setup from front to rear. I know it wont be optimal for auto-x tight corners, but my concern with neutral feel is in track corners not auto'x corners. I know for auto-x setups many run under -1 degree of rear camber and about -3 up front.

Ah! I understand now.

Go for the safer track setup, but with an eye toward some rotation. -1.5 or -1.6 camber in the rear will be fine for this. You won't be completely happy with it for autoX, but it'll be ok.

If you have time and inclination you could just start changing the alignment setups for each event....

I suggest lowering plates because from what I understand it's going to be a while until you get coilovers, and they certainly aren't going to hurt coilover performance so you can use them now and later.

For the front about -3 to -3.5 for a course that sees decent straights (I know that sounds backwards, but think about it - more camber hurts straight line and braking). Keep in mind - that's what works for us. Don't take that as gospel, but use it as a starting point.

You may not be able to get that on your current setup, and that's ok. Go with what you can, and just know you can work on technique that way you'll be that much faster later on.

[gOt_rally?]

Originally Posted by Turninconcepts.com

Ah! I understand now.

Go for the safer track setup, but with an eye toward some rotation. -1.5 or -1.6 camber in the rear will be fine for this. You won't be completely happy with it for autoX, but it'll be ok.

If you have time and inclination you could just start changing the alignment setups for each event....

I suggest lowering plates because from what I understand it's going to be a while until you get coilovers, and they certainly aren't going to hurt coilover performance so you can use them now and later.

For the front about -3 to -3.5 for a course that sees decent straights (I know that sounds backwards, but think about it - more camber hurts straight line and braking). Keep in mind - that's what works for us. Don't take that as gospel, but use it as a starting point.

You may not be able to get that on your current setup, and that's ok. Go with what you can, and just know you can work on technique that way you'll be that much faster later on.

Thank you for all the great information