concealed carry - Page 3

Late · 05-09-2008, 03:41 PM

For it. I took the concealed carry class here in Fla. but just never submitted the paperwork to the state afterwards (I ended up selling my pistol, so didn't see the need). It would be nice if people who chose to carry were responsible enough to practice/shoot regularly so that the chance of mistakes would be lessened if they ever felt the need to use their weapon.

I don't think it'd be much of a crime deterrent as some people claim, because I seriously doubt the common criminal stops to consider the number of people out there who might be carrying.

Boost Fan · 05-09-2008, 06:10 PM

For it!! I live in Kentucky and have had my CC for about 6 years. Most states don't let just anyone have the license. I had to attend an 8 hour class and then demonstrate at the range that I was safe and competent with a pistol. In the class we learned all the provisions of the law and we made sure we understood exactly what constitutes "self-defense". I mentioned that last part because several have posted CC's may go wacko and seek out dangerous situations just to play vigilante. I just don't think that is likely to happen. The class made it perfectly clear that if I shoot outside the law or behave unsafely and someone is killed I will definitely be prosecuted for murder. THAT is what keeps us CC's from going wacko. As for the police, well....the police always say " first priority is to go home at the end of the shift." Well I share their same sense of self preservation. I am going to protect myself first and then worry about the nervous cop later. Finally has anyone notice where all the shootings have been taking place lately?? At churches, schools and courthouses. We all know where the law prohibits citizens from carrying a weapon...(all together now!!)....churches, schools and courthouses!!

scubadiver424 · 05-09-2008, 09:15 PM

Having the right to Bear arms however you want to interpret it is one of the many reasons that makes America a unique country. That being said, I see nothing wrong with legal concealed carry. (Currently Carry a Glock 36 and Ruger LCP). Those who obtain a permit, and practice to remain accurate in all sorts of scenarios are good to go in my mind. Those people who take matters into their own hands if they own a gun and arent immediately at risk of becoming mincemeat, usually are not carrying legally,since most classes teach the implications of drawing and firing your weapon...

hoffit · 05-09-2008, 09:48 PM

I've been carrying for almost 5 years. I need to renew my license here in MN in the next 3-4 weeks. The biggest thing about carrying a gun is that it really limits your behavior.

If some freak decides to do something, your options are no longer to whip the crap out of him. It's either pull it out or don't. Therefore in 99.99% of the cases you'll need to back down. Avoidance of situations is the best method for defense though I firmly believe in a back up like my HK40 as you'll never know what life will throw at you.

1loudsti · 05-10-2008, 10:28 PM

i wish state legislators could read this thread! they will see that there are plenty of good reasons for this to happen and with the correct classes and backround checks the chances of a legal carrying citizen is going to cause a violent crime

jaydow11 · 05-11-2008, 09:17 AM

So why don't we just limit guns to just Police and not only make owning a gun illegle but also ban all imports of guns and stop the local production of hand guns?

I know it would almost be impossible to do but that's really the only way do it. Again, I don't think giving someone who's only requirement is to pass a test but dones't necessarily have proper training a gun!

Why do most police in England not wear a gun? Because they don't need to! So why is that? I think because they have a fundamental difference in their attitued and "rights" towards guns!

M3-to-STI · 05-11-2008, 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaydow11

So why don't we just limit guns to just Police and not only make owning a gun illegle but also ban all imports of guns and stop the local production of hand guns?

I know it would almost be impossible to do but that's really the only way do it. Again, I don't think giving someone who's only requirement is to pass a test but dones't necessarily have proper training a gun!

Why do most police in England not wear a gun? Because they don't need to! So why is that? I think because they have a fundamental difference in their attitued and "rights" towards guns!

English cops carry no guns????

http://www.idruna.com/images/PhojoCu...os/MaxNash.jpg

Those are some serious looking billy clubs.....

STFU now please.

Late · 05-11-2008, 10:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by M3-to-STI

English cops carry no guns????

Those are some serious looking billy clubs.....

STFU now please.

he actually has a good point about English police, the majority of them Don't carry. I'm sure it's easy to wade through a few pictures to find an exception, but it doesn't mean that all of them carry like that.

**boondocksaint** · 05-11-2008, 10:27 AM

Comparing England to America is effectively an apples-to-oranges effort at this point in time.

English police officers are NOT routinely armed. They wear firearms only in certain areas or for certain operations, such as the one pictured above.

BBC News | UK | Life of Crime | Police and firearms

That's a pretty lightly-written article, but you get the idea. The reason ENGLISH officers are now forced to carry firearms in certain situations has NOTHING to do with law-abiding AMERICAN citizens carrying concealed. The Brits are forced to arm because, wonder of wonders, criminals can still get hold of guns regardless of the laws restricting private citizens.

I'll let the shock of that wear off a moment. Okay? Good.

What Britain does is irrelevant, though I think there may be an object lesson there. If you'd rather your police officers did not carry, or you want to live in an area where concealed carry/handgun ownership is strictly regulated, there are places in this country and others to which you can move. Be careful, though. Do some research. These places aren't always as safe as you think.

I'm not going to go into any more BS about whether the right to own guns is good/bad/green/up/three/bagel or any other completely off-topic thought. If you want to discuss the basic foundations of the right to bear arms, do so in a different thread please. This is the second time I've asked this. Please don't make me do it again.

***Bownse*** · 05-11-2008, 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaydow11

However, in the greatly more technically advanced world (NA) we live in today, is that "right" still necessary?

one need only look back as far as the LA riots and see that gun owners protected their property and their shops. the cops pulled out and set up a perimeter. keep both good and bag guy inside the war zone. people without guns (you know, the ones who voted for waiting periods and such) came to owners begging to borrow a firearm to protect their family and property. the wise gun owner sent them away with a reminder of how they had voted in the past.

look at most cases where the cops are called. they can't be there when the event happens unless by luck. they come in, set up a perimeter, and mop up the mess. the protection of yourself, your family and your property rests on your shoulders. you may choose to abdicate that responsibility but when you do, you live with the reality that no one will be there for you during the first 30 minutes of a crisis (if that soon).

***Bownse*** · 05-11-2008, 12:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaydow11

I guess the only way to see if it would work would be to implement it.... But as if that will ever happen....

it's been done. 2 case studies begun in the 80's.

town 1 banned all gun ownership.
town 2 passed a law that each household had to own a firearm.

crime rose faster in town 1 than in the surrounding communities. crime dropped faster in town 2 than either the surrounding communites OR the national average.

town 1: Morton Grove, Ill
town 2: Kennesaw, Ga.

Politics Fuels Mandatory Gun Ownership Laws -- 09/11/2001

scubadiver424 · 05-11-2008, 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by boondocksaint

Comparing England to America is effectively an apples-to-oranges effort at this point in time.

English police officers are NOT routinely armed. They wear firearms only in certain areas or for certain operations, such as the one pictured above.

BBC News | UK | Life of Crime | Police and firearms

That's a pretty lightly-written article, but you get the idea. The reason ENGLISH officers are now forced to carry firearms in certain situations has NOTHING to do with law-abiding AMERICAN citizens carrying concealed. The Brits are forced to arm because, wonder of wonders, criminals can still get hold of guns regardless of the laws restricting private citizens.

I'll let the shock of that wear off a moment. Okay? Good.

What Britain does is irrelevant, though I think there may be an object lesson there. If you'd rather your police officers did not carry, or you want to live in an area where concealed carry/handgun ownership is strictly regulated, there are places in this country and others to which you can move. Be careful, though. Do some research. These places aren't always as safe as you think.

I'm not going to go into any more BS about whether the right to own guns is good/bad/green/up/three/bagel or any other completely off-topic thought. If you want to discuss the basic foundations of the right to bear arms, do so in a different thread please. This is the second time I've asked this. Please don't make me do it again.

Extremely well put man.

jaydow11 · 05-11-2008, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by M3-to-STI

English cops carry no guns????

http://www.idruna.com/images/PhojoCu...os/MaxNash.jpg

Those are some serious looking billy clubs.....

STFU now please.

EDIT: You shouldn't be alowed on the internet!

jaydow11 · 05-11-2008, 07:38 PM

I'm just trying to show that other countries don't have the same problem has the US does and i'm trying to figure out why that is.

What other countries do is relevent as we might be able to LEARN something from them. no?

In any event, because a lot of people in the US have been brought up in this type of environment, it's not surprise that you guys are all for concealed carry and people owning hand guns.

Even if my view is wrong, which would only be if your view is different, I'm tying to show different angles.

You can't get creative if everyone jumps on the same band wagon and all has the same ideas...

Lets show a little respect for people in this conversation please!

1loudsti · 05-11-2008, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaydow11

I'm just trying to show that other countries don't have the same problem has the US does and i'm trying to figure out why that is.

What other countries do is relevent as we might be able to LEARN something from them. no?

In any event, because a lot of people in the US have been brought up in this type of environment, it's not surprise that you guys are all for concealed carry and people owning hand guns.

Even if my view is wrong, which would only be if your view is different, I'm tying to show different angles.

You can't get creative if everyone jumps on the same band wagon and all has the same ideas...

Lets show a little respect for people in this conversation please!

just because the police dont carry guns doesnt mean they dont have the same problems...the english culture is alot different but they still have the problems

besides im sure he wouldnt have responded that way if you had found a city/county in the USA that the police didnt carry because that would be directly related

05-09-2008, 03:41 PM	#31
Late Professional STI Driver Car: 05 PSM STi - Sold Fav Mod: V1 Location: Tampa Posts: 421 Join Date: Feb 2006 Trader Rating: (3)	Re: concealed carry For it. I took the concealed carry class here in Fla. but just never submitted the paperwork to the state afterwards (I ended up selling my pistol, so didn't see the need). It would be nice if people who chose to carry were responsible enough to practice/shoot regularly so that the chance of mistakes would be lessened if they ever felt the need to use their weapon. I don't think it'd be much of a crime deterrent as some people claim, because I seriously doubt the common criminal stops to consider the number of people out there who might be carrying. This ad is not endorsed by this member. Please register or login to hide this ad.

05-09-2008, 06:10 PM	#32
Boost Fan Amateur STI Driver Car: 05 WRX STi Fav Mod: no mods yet Posts: 15 Join Date: Jun 2006 Trader Rating: (0)	Re: concealed carry For it!! I live in Kentucky and have had my CC for about 6 years. Most states don't let just anyone have the license. I had to attend an 8 hour class and then demonstrate at the range that I was safe and competent with a pistol. In the class we learned all the provisions of the law and we made sure we understood exactly what constitutes "self-defense". I mentioned that last part because several have posted CC's may go wacko and seek out dangerous situations just to play vigilante. I just don't think that is likely to happen. The class made it perfectly clear that if I shoot outside the law or behave unsafely and someone is killed I will definitely be prosecuted for murder. THAT is what keeps us CC's from going wacko. As for the police, well....the police always say " first priority is to go home at the end of the shift." Well I share their same sense of self preservation. I am going to protect myself first and then worry about the nervous cop later. Finally has anyone notice where all the shootings have been taking place lately?? At churches, schools and courthouses. We all know where the law prohibits citizens from carrying a weapon...(all together now!!)....churches, schools and courthouses!!

05-09-2008, 09:15 PM	#33
scubadiver424 S204 Racer Car: 06 WRB GOLD STI Fav Mod: NRA Sticker Location: US of A Posts: 3,623 Join Date: Mar 2006 Trader Rating: (8)	Re: concealed carry Having the right to Bear arms however you want to interpret it is one of the many reasons that makes America a unique country. That being said, I see nothing wrong with legal concealed carry. (Currently Carry a Glock 36 and Ruger LCP). Those who obtain a permit, and practice to remain accurate in all sorts of scenarios are good to go in my mind. Those people who take matters into their own hands if they own a gun and arent immediately at risk of becoming mincemeat, usually are not carrying legally,since most classes teach the implications of drawing and firing your weapon...

05-09-2008, 09:48 PM	#34
hoffit Professional STI Racer Car: 04 Subaru WRX STi Fav Mod: Carlabs X-brace & RPM brace Location: MN Posts: 639 Join Date: Oct 2005 Trader Rating: (8)	Re: concealed carry I've been carrying for almost 5 years. I need to renew my license here in MN in the next 3-4 weeks. The biggest thing about carrying a gun is that it really limits your behavior. If some freak decides to do something, your options are no longer to whip the crap out of him. It's either pull it out or don't. Therefore in 99.99% of the cases you'll need to back down. Avoidance of situations is the best method for defense though I firmly believe in a back up like my HK40 as you'll never know what life will throw at you.

05-10-2008, 10:28 PM	#35
1loudsti Silver Member Car: CGM 05 Fav Mod: IAG 38mm EWG Location: racine,wi Posts: 1,107 Join Date: Mar 2008 Trader Rating: (1)	Re: concealed carry i wish state legislators could read this thread! they will see that there are plenty of good reasons for this to happen and with the correct classes and backround checks the chances of a legal carrying citizen is going to cause a violent crime

05-11-2008, 09:17 AM	#36
jaydow11 Silver Member Car: 06 STI UGM Fav Mod: (o)(o) Location: Kelowna Posts: 1,118 Join Date: Jul 2006 Trader Rating: (0)	Re: concealed carry So why don't we just limit guns to just Police and not only make owning a gun illegle but also ban all imports of guns and stop the local production of hand guns? I know it would almost be impossible to do but that's really the only way do it. Again, I don't think giving someone who's only requirement is to pass a test but dones't necessarily have proper training a gun! Why do most police in England not wear a gun? Because they don't need to! So why is that? I think because they have a fundamental difference in their attitued and "rights" towards guns!

05-11-2008, 10:27 AM	#39
boondocksaint Reasonable Car: Boony's Motown STi Fav Mod: correct grammar Location: D3TR01T Posts: 22,580 Join Date: Jun 2006 Trader Rating: (5)	Re: concealed carry Comparing England to America is effectively an apples-to-oranges effort at this point in time. English police officers are NOT routinely armed. They wear firearms only in certain areas or for certain operations, such as the one pictured above. BBC News \| UK \| Life of Crime \| Police and firearms That's a pretty lightly-written article, but you get the idea. The reason ENGLISH officers are now forced to carry firearms in certain situations has NOTHING to do with law-abiding AMERICAN citizens carrying concealed. The Brits are forced to arm because, wonder of wonders, criminals can still get hold of guns regardless of the laws restricting private citizens. I'll let the shock of that wear off a moment. Okay? Good. What Britain does is irrelevant, though I think there may be an object lesson there. If you'd rather your police officers did not carry, or you want to live in an area where concealed carry/handgun ownership is strictly regulated, there are places in this country and others to which you can move. Be careful, though. Do some research. These places aren't always as safe as you think. I'm not going to go into any more BS about whether the right to own guns is good/bad/green/up/three/bagel or any other completely off-topic thought. If you want to discuss the basic foundations of the right to bear arms, do so in a different thread please. This is the second time I've asked this. Please don't make me do it again.

05-11-2008, 07:38 PM	#44
jaydow11 Silver Member Car: 06 STI UGM Fav Mod: (o)(o) Location: Kelowna Posts: 1,118 Join Date: Jul 2006 Trader Rating: (0)	Re: concealed carry I'm just trying to show that other countries don't have the same problem has the US does and i'm trying to figure out why that is. What other countries do is relevent as we might be able to LEARN something from them. no? In any event, because a lot of people in the US have been brought up in this type of environment, it's not surprise that you guys are all for concealed carry and people owning hand guns. Even if my view is wrong, which would only be if your view is different, I'm tying to show different angles. You can't get creative if everyone jumps on the same band wagon and all has the same ideas... Lets show a little respect for people in this conversation please! Last edited by jaydow11 : 05-11-2008 at 07:55 PM.