[ChazzMichaelMichaels]

NASIOC - View Single Post - COBB IS LOCKING YOUR ECU W/APv2

That's a link to my reply to Shane from Cobb.

It sounds to me like what he's saying is that the ECU is effectively write protected and as a result prevents itself from being reflashed (even by the dealer). If that's so, it sounds like a bit of a red flag since it would tip off the mechanic that the ECU was changed.

I could be completely wrong though, probably should wait for Shane's response. Just thought I'd bring it to your attention.

[halfelite]

The mechanic would know that the ecu was changed in the first place if they really cared about it. I understand there thinking on. But if anyone really cares just dont update your firmware.

[jagstyle]

yeah, the latest cobb firmware locks out the ecu regardless of what the tuner chooses to do (previously the tuner had the option to lock or not). It's only locked while the AP is married so simply unmarry the AP if you need to take it in to the dealer

you can still datalog of course but you can't pull the rom or reflash

It really pisses me off that they did this . It pissed off my tuner as well as he is no longer able to make tweaks using open source tools

[neverendingmods]

2 main reasons behind this.
1st it prevents somebody witha protune from having their ecu reflashed by Subaru when they take cars in for servicing(07 SOA multiple ecu updates).Looks like the 08's will have ecu software updates from SOA aswell.

2nd- Most importantly it prevents people from hacking the Cobb software and using somebodies protune to Rom flash it onto anothers car. Even the Base Cobb maps are being hacked and tweaked by people selling E-mail maps for open ecu. Cobb is making sure they aren't loosing $ due to a 3rd party using their shell maps.

[JDM-STI]

It's bad business though if YOUR tuner is unable to make tweaks to YOUR map via email, like I've had to do several times before. If they don't figure a better way to do this, they may lose out on some peoples business that they would have normally had.

[elirentz]

^ Sure they can still make tweaks and send them to you over email with protuner. Why wouldn't they?

[yakkosmurf]

It's not that big a deal. You can still update maps over protuner and email them. There's a Cobb rep on nasioc doing that right now to test out new maps. Also, you should unmarry the AP anyway before sending the car in for service. This was more of an issue with the v1 as well, since the dealer could erase your program with an update of their own, thereby rendering your AP useless. Now, at least there's protection from that. But, you should still unmarry it anyway.

[Wes]

how do you unmarry the accessport from the car when you're running injectors, external wastegate, catless, and other mods where a tune is REQUIRED for the car to run?

[solovus]

Originally Posted by WESTI

how do you unmarry the accessport from the car when you're running injectors, external wastegate, catless, and other mods where a tune is REQUIRED for the car to run?

I think at this point unmarrying it is not realistic since you need the tune and the dealer will notice the other things that void your warranty anyway.


I don't see what the big deal is...the AP user still has complete control and should be unmarrying it anyway...and as WESTI said if you absolutely -need- the tune then the dealer will void your warranty anyway and now you don't have to worry about some dipsh*t overwriting your tune.


I fail to see the problem.

[Merchgod]

Originally Posted by neverendingmods

Even the Base Cobb maps are being hacked and tweaked by people selling E-mail maps for open ecu. Cobb is making sure they aren't loosing $ due to a 3rd party using their shell maps.

I've never heard nor seen this happening. If you are going to post up an accusation as fact (and implying that every business selling openecu maps does this), then you better have something to back it up. The openecu developers do not condone the stealing of any maps or code regardless. Sites, such as RomRaider, do not allow any commercial roms or code on the site and no discussion related to hacking commercial products. Sure, there are punks who might use openecu tools on their own to retrieve Cobb maps and flash them to their friend's cars. However, I've never heard of any business selling maps tuned with openecu tools using a Cobb ROM as a base. And the responses from actual Cobb employees about why they added the "lock" do not mention or imply this whatsoever.

[gabedude]

Originally Posted by neverendingmods

2 main reasons behind this.
1st it prevents somebody witha protune from having their ecu reflashed by Subaru when they take cars in for servicing(07 SOA multiple ecu updates).Looks like the 08's will have ecu software updates from SOA aswell.

2nd- Most importantly it prevents people from hacking the Cobb software and using somebodies protune to Rom flash it onto anothers car. Even the Base Cobb maps are being hacked and tweaked by people selling E-mail maps for open ecu. Cobb is making sure they aren't loosing $ due to a 3rd party using their shell maps.

1. The 07 STI has had one update. It is not even a TSB.

2. Have you looked at a Cobb rom? Why would any tuner use it? OpenECU tools are meant for tuning, not stealing. The Cobb roms are so close to stock, they are barely tuned. I don't know of anyone who uses them as a base, even protuners. Of all the Cobb roms I have logged/pulled, the IAM was not at 1 (not that that is a bad thing for an OTS map) and the car would always knock a good bit. Trust me, I have ripped a few people a new one for trying to steal Cobb roms. IMHO, it is not right to do this and there is no point anyway. Read the Cobb map notes. They do exactly what they say they do, no more, no less. Now if you cannot replicate that from a stock rom, perhaps you should not be using OpenECU.

[neverendingmods]

Originally Posted by Merchgod

I've never heard nor seen this happening. If you are going to post up an accusation as fact (and implying that every business selling openecu maps does this), then you better have something to back it up. The openecu developers do not condone the stealing of any maps or code regardless. Sites, such as RomRaider, do not allow any commercial roms or code on the site and no discussion related to hacking commercial products. Sure, there are punks who might use openecu tools on their own to retrieve Cobb maps and flash them to their friend's cars. However, I've never heard of any business selling maps tuned with openecu tools using a Cobb ROM as a base. And the responses from actual Cobb employees about why they added the "lock" do not mention or imply this whatsoever.

Than due to the SOA rewriting ECU software which is alot more common than people think. don't redline your 08 sti !!! . A 08 REcall of STi's for mandatory Rom flashing. The 07's had it,but not a mandatory recall. Even the 04's that were located in states that use 91 oct gas had to be reflashed. In regards to the Cobb software not being able to be hacked or viewed. It can be hacked. Am I gonna drop the dime on somebody after I find the writeup. NO!

[Merchgod]

Originally Posted by neverendingmods

In regards to the Cobb software not being able to be hacked or viewed. It can be hacked. Am I gonna drop the dime on somebody after I find the writeup. NO!

Please, do not post something you "heard" or guessed as fact if you do not have the first clue what you talking about. No one of any skill or importance in the openecu community is going to even consider hacking Cobb's lock. Not only because that would be inappropriate and considered stealing, but also because it would be a complete waste of time and pointless. Hacks like launch control and real-time tuning are relatively easy to implement. There's no magic super-secret formula that only Cobb can come up with. In fact, I've already tested a real-time setup that will allow for real-time selection of any 2d/3d table in the ECU at any time. That is, you can choose any assortment of tables you want for RT tuning and change the assortment without flashing. The problem is, it is a major time consuming PITA to set up a user interface to support RTT. Not that we don't know what needs to be done - it's just no one has the time right now to work on it. Which is why you haven't seen it yet from the openecu community.

The only people doing the stealing are punks that can barely operate a computer who pull their Cobb rom, sell their AP, and then continue to use their Cobb rom. Or they pull their protune and email it to their friends. The openecu community doesn't tolerate this type of behavior, but like everything else, you can't stop everyone. I'm glad that Cobb has finally done the "lock" as it will nip this in the bud.

[lawnmower22]

Did anybody read the whole thread? This should ease some peoples minds.



We were a few days away from announcing the release date for the AccessTUNER Race (formerly StreetTUNER) software so I don't have a more formal release completed yet but I can fill you all in on the details in a rough draft. This represents decisions made many, many moons ago and we hope it reflects the current needs of the fellow enthusiast.

AccessTUNER Race for new AccessPORTs
Release date: August 25th, 2008
Price: $0, FREE web download.

The process will work as such:
1) A link from our website will go active on August 25th to download the AccessTUNER Race software.
2) You visit the link and fill out a basic survey/questionnaire.
3) We email you a download link.
4) You download, install, and start tuning!

The software is vehicle specific, and is not limited in any table/parameter access. It offers the exact SAME depth of access to ECU parameters as the Pro version. So if you have a new AccessPORT, you can Real Time tune, datalog, etc just like the Pro version.

The software will NOT allow you to open up other Pro maps (.ptm) aside from the COBB maps. We're opening up ALL of our maps for you to use as starting points for your tune. That literally means you just open the maps already on your AccessPORT, download the ones on our website, etc and start tuning. IF you have a Pro tuned map that you want to adjust, all you need to do is contact your original tuner and ask that they send the map for you in the Race format (their software can already do this, it's as easy as File->Open, pick your map, and File->Save->Race... a whopping 5-10 seconds of work). You can then view the exact details of your map, edit it, etc. And just like the original software, you can share maps with one another, and so on.

We can start another more official thread to discuss this if you'd all like. I just figured this would be a good place to make everyone aware of our plans.

Cheers,
Trey @ COBB

[elirentz]

Wow this is great info! Free??!!!! You guys rock. Time to call my tuner and try to plead for a race map. Will the datalogger have a graphing function?