[WolfPlayer]

Tonight I installed the Group-N Engine mounts + Pitch mount. Some Notes...

0) Here are the pics I took of just the mounts when I received them:
http://www.bescaredracing.com/sti/mounts/

1) The 2005 STi already has the Group-N Pitching mount according to the what is specified as Group-N under the japanese Group-N website. Yes, I am positive. Yes, I did get a Group-N Pitching mount (ordered from King of Imports, KOI). This is what I received from KOI ...

http://www.bescaredracing.com/sti/mo.../ST410404S000/

You'll note that the part number clearly matches the Part Number on SOA's Group-N website ...

http://www.subaru-sti.co.jp/e/GRN/parts/list.html

My stock mount was 100% the same except for a white STi stamp on the one received from KOI (http://www.bescaredracing.com/sti/mo..._ST410404S000/). I checked all part numbers on the pitching mount and all part numbers were the same. The bushings in the pitch mount had the exact same part numbers too. I also performed the familiar 'fingernail durometer test' and they were exactly the same. FWIW, I performed this same test on the engine and tranny mounts (stock vs. group-n) and it was rediculously easy to see the difference in hardness using your fingernail. So, if you have a 2005 STi then don't waste your money on thispitch mount! Rather, go out and buy the recommended SPT Pitch Mount. This is part number ST4100055140 and it looks like this ...

http://www.gruppe-s.com/Subaru/subeng/sti_ps.jpg

Notice the widened version of the plastic mount. Much much much more beefy. Be very careful about who you order the so-called 'upgraded Group-N' pitch mount from! I found that BOTH King of Imports and Racecompengineering are delivering the weaker ST410404S000 mount that uses the thinner plastic mount. You don't want that! You want the beefy plastic mount that is recommended on spt.subaru.com under part number ST4100055140.

2) I used the destructions from ScoobyMods to do the mounts (http://www.scoobymods.com/forums/showthread.php?t=545). I am no stranger to doing engine mounts. Been there done that on other cars. Don't be fooled by the scoobymods document. This is time consuming and a PITA ... but completely doable. One reason it was a PITA to do for me was because I did it on ramps. A lift would make the job more bearable since you aren't consistently squeezing in and out from under the car (between the front and rear tires because the jack is in the way in the front holding the engine up).

3) When you jack up on the oil pan you WILL jack up the car a couple inches before the motor begins jacking on it's own. I thought something was wrong ... but, this appears to be normal. The frontend will raise a couple inches on it's own before the motor mounts begin rising away from the frame.

4) The motor mount PLATES on the 2005 are absolutely identical to the Group-N motor mount PLATES except that the stock plates have heat shielding. On each mount I reused my stock plates because they were identical and because you can benefit from the heat shielding.

5) The rear mount bolts that bolt the mount to the motor truly are a PITA. All the other bolts are cakewalk and make you think it is going to be easy.

6) On the driver's side you want to use your wrench OVER the axle shaft (green CV joint). Your first instinct is to use it under the axle. No. Use the 12-pt side of the wrench over the axle. Most wrenches have slight angles at the 12-pt end. Use the appropriate angle where you angle the wrench up. That is the key. Use interlocking wrenches to break the bolt. Use your wrench to move the bolt out enough so that it is very loose. Have somebody hold up the mount from the other end as you reach one hand over the axle and one hand under the axle (rediculously tight corners here!) and use your fingertips to rotate the bolt out. Having the other person hold the mount up takes the pressure off the bolt allowing you to rotate it out. If you have big hands then I don't know how you do it (maybe jack the motor up more). To install the bolt insert the front bolt FIRST and loosely tighten the mount against the motor. You want to tighten it in such a way so that there is complete alignment between the hole in the plate and the hole in the block. This will leave one less thing for you to worry about as you try to get that bolt in. To get the bolt in I did something similar to what I did to get it out ... one hand over the CV and one hand under it.

7) The passenger side is a pain in the ass almost more because there was no way to get 2 hands in there. Good luck. I wish I had advice ... I only have a bunch of scratched up knuckles.

8.) Nobody told me that putting the intercooler on was such a PITA. WTF? It's cake to get the WRX intercooler on. I had a really hard time getting the red hose from the cooler to the turbo on ... the bottom of the hose kept getting caught in the turbo. Miraculously it went on ... not sure how. Frucked with it for 1/2 hr.

9) IMHO, this is a scary mod. But, I am paranoid. Since you have to reach in there with your hands ... and the motor is only held up by a jack ... if that jack fell then your hand(s) would get crushed. That's a scary thought. Granted, a 3-ton jack should be able to support several hundred pounds without failing. But, if it did then you would be screwed. I'd seriously suggest having 2 jacks available and supporting with more than one jack.

10) Huge thanks to FredRex for the help and for the garage space.

EDIT:
1) I also installed the STi Group-N Tranny mount and KartBoy bushings:
http://www.imprezawrxsti.com/postnuk...415&highlight=
2) The 6MT Group-N Tranny Mount is dull ... not shiny like the 5MT Group-N mount:
http://www.imprezawrxsti.com/postnuk...977&highlight=

I have no report right now on how the engine mounts feel or perform. I'm tired and didn't pay attention on the drive home. That's good because that also means that I did not notice a lot of extra noise. The Group-N mounts are a LOT harder than the stock mounts. The stock mounts felt like big soft rubber. The Group-N's were nice and hard. The difference was easily noticeable with the stock part in one hand and the Group-N part in the other hand.

t

[Crewchief]

Damn, and i just ordered the pitch mount for my 05.....lol.

[2cati]

Please post your report when you have time !

I have a 2004 and was planning on replacing the pitch mount...


In addition to what you've done I want to eliminate he diff clunk under accelleraton.

from Racecomp:
RCE-4151 -- Differential Rear Support Member MY02-04 -- $100

Look forward to your report!!!

[WolfPlayer]

Originally Posted by 2cati

Please post your report when you have time !

I have a 2004 and was planning on replacing the pitch mount...


In addition to what you've done I want to eliminate he diff clunk under accelleraton.

from Racecomp:
RCE-4151 -- Differential Rear Support Member MY02-04 -- $100

Look forward to your report!!!

On the drive to work this morning I noticed 'almost' nothing. There was a little bit of extra noise ... but it was so small that the wife definitely won't notice it (not that that matters - just a point of reference). Definitely a more 'connected' feeling ... but, it wasn't as big as what I had it built up in my mind. This mod was as similar as putting poly motor mounts in my camaro. The engine defintely moves less at idle and you can clearly see that with the hood open. Startups are also slightly quicker. Some of that idle vibration is transmitted to the seat. However, it is such a small transmission of vibration that nobody would notice it. IMHO, the NVH is a non-issue with the STi as long as you are still running the super loud Bridgestone RE070s. I would hazard a guess and say that I would be able to notice it more if I didn't have these super loud tires on the car.

As far as the performance, nothing super big yet. All subtle stuff. Definitely NOT a WOW, this is awesome!. Like I said, it's all subtle. But, then again, the 2005 STi already had the Group-N Pitch Mount along with the Group-N motor mount plates. Plus the car is new (1164 miles) so the stock motor mounts were hardly worn. Plus I have the super loud RE070's on the car.

Yea, I didn't forget the rear diff bushing. That'll be on the way soon. Also don't forget replacement bushings for the arms that come out from the rear to the edge of the car (where the whiteline pancake bushings go)! It is these bushings along with the diff mount piece that will make the difference (or so I have researched ... but, then again, who knows ... maybe we already have 1 or both of these already in the car given that we have the Group-N pitch).

t

[KingofImports.com]

Yes, we are looking into this.

With regard to the Control Arm bushings you mention, we were told the group n upgrade is not worth the money or install time. However, nobody has done it that we know of to confirm or deny this.

Kevin

[WolfPlayer]

A link to my NASIOC post on the Pitch mount similarities...
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=652280

[red5001]

Not sure if this applies but when buying a the STi tranny mount the parts numbers of the groupN version is the same as the stock mount. The same molds are used I suppose. Here is some info on it. It might be similar to the engine mounts and such.

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=530759

[WolfPlayer]

Originally Posted by red5001

Not sure if this applies but when buying a the STi tranny mount the parts numbers of the groupN version is the same as the stock mount. The same molds are used I suppose. Here is some info on it. It might be similar to the engine mounts and such.

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=530759

Thanks a lot for that reference. I was worried that my 'new' tranny mount looks like the old one (not shiny like the motor mounts). I figured out the deal with the pitch mount! Here is a copy and paste from my last post on NABISCO with regard to that situation ...

"I think I have it figured out.

The Subaru Performance Tuning Site (http://spt.subaru.com/microsites/spt/main.jsp) lists upgrades for our cars. The upgraded pitch stop is listed as Part Number ST4100055140 and that part looks like this...
http://www.gruppe-s.com/Subaru/subeng/sti_ps.jpg

The Japanese Group-N website lists Group-N parts for our cars. The pitch mount is listed as Part Number ST410404S000 and that part looks like this ...
http://www.subaru-sti.co.jp/e/GRN/pa...00_pstoper.jpg

The '05 USDM STi has a pitch mount that looks and feels exactly like the one mentioned on the Japanese Group-N website.

The upgrade for the '05 is not the Group-N specified part but the part as listed on the Subaru Performance Tuning site. I have no explanation as to why the Japanese Group-N website doesn't list the same one as on the SPT site. It is rather obvious that the part listed on the SPT site is much more heavy duty than the one listed on the Group-N site.

Long story short: If you are doing upgraded mounts on your STi then make sure you get the SPT part ST4100055140. THAT is the part you want.
"

[WolfPlayer]

I wanted to be sure before posting this new observation. I'm now sure The clutch engagement from a dead stop is now much quicker. The engagement comes on right away. I notice this because I am a new manual driver ... this is my first manual car. It is easier to stall the car now (haven't stalled it yet but that point of fluttering comes on much quicker if you don't get it just right). I guess the mounts are no longer cushioning the engagement. As the clutch begins to engage, the motor can't cushion the engagement through the mounts. Rather, the clutch just grabs. So, everything just feels tighter.

I am also now noticing a new vibration around my A-Pillar in the higher RPMs at WOT. You definitely can feel/hear the motor more at WOT than before.

t

[WolfPlayer]

Updated my very first post in this thread with regard to all the pitch mount info I have discovered so far.

[esemes]

solid gold

please stickie this!

[WolfPlayer]

Finally received the correct mount. I ordered it from subaruwrxparts.com

http://www.bescaredracing.com/sti/mo.../ST4100055140/

[BlackedoutSTI]

YOU JACKED THE CAR UP BY THE PAN!!!!! WOW thats risky. not to bash you but in my opinion thats not the way to do it.

[WolfPlayer]

Originally Posted by BlackedoutSTI

YOU JACKED THE CAR UP BY THE PAN!!!!! WOW thats risky. not to bash you but in my opinion thats not the way to do it.

That's pretty much the only way to do it. Let me know if you have a better way. Don't say jacking it up by the engine pulley - that is 100x worse. The engine oil pan USED ON THE SUBARUS is plenty strong enough for this purpose. I have done it MANY times. There is no issue.

Again, discuss a better way to jack up the motor. I am all ears. The only true alternative is to lift it via an engine hoist. Good luck with that. You won't find ANY shop doing that simply for motor mounts. Every shop will do it similarly to how I mentioned. Welcome to engine mounts on a subaru (and the same holds true for 82-92 camaros and firebirds too).

t

[Crewchief]

wow over 2 years and back from the dead. How you new guys find these, lol?