[metalheadinky]

I have been looking into buying a short block that will be able to withstand 500+ horsepower at the wheels. I have been looking into amr, axis, crawford, cobb, cosworth, and ar fab. I figure it will cost around $9k for a really good short block and probably another $6k for heads and cams. Has anyone had any business with these engine builders? I would like to find a 2.8L if their is such a sti engine.

[berdugo]

Crawford's R4 is 2.8L
Crawford Performance

[EuroScuby]

Check out Gruppe-S motors too at:
Impreza Engine

[rjacobs]

ron at Axis, thats all you need for block and heads He will build you a ****in sick motor for 15k

[Neanderthal Racing]

i recommend that you do not go crazy on headwork for a dd. in fact, you do not need new heads at all. save your money. it is easy to go overboard on porting.

just upgrade the springs and retainers, do a good cleanup on your stock heads with a stg1 p&p. add a set of stg 2 or 3 kelford/cosworth cams (cosworth are kelfords) and youre in business.

[twigg107]

Originally Posted by metalheadinky

I have been looking into buying a short block that will be able to withstand 500+ horsepower at the wheels. I have been looking into amr, axis, crawford, cobb, cosworth, and ar fab. I figure it will cost around $9k for a really good short block and probably another $6k for heads and cams. Has anyone had any business with these engine builders? I would like to find a 2.8L if their is such a sti engine.

I prefer having a local builder only because if something does go wrong, they can fix it faster. My brother up in seattle is building his own 2.7L block himself using brian crower stroker kit.

[Flycaster]

Cross Cobb off your list - they aren't building any blocks until/unless they hire another builder.

[jordanretro1223]

I'd go with Axis, Cosworth or Crawford. You always know you'll be getting quality.

[Draco-REX]

Originally Posted by Neanderthal Racing

i recommend that you do not go crazy on headwork for a dd. in fact, you do not need new heads at all. save your money. it is easy to go overboard on porting.

just upgrade the springs and retainers, do a good cleanup on your stock heads with a stg1 p&p. add a set of stg 2 or 3 kelford/cosworth cams (cosworth are kelfords) and youre in business.

You've done a crapload of research. Is it possible to rework the stock heads to get an 8K or 9K redline? And would this hurt DD ability?

The only issue I see is having a Turbo that can feed a 9K redline, and that might mean a big, laggy snail.

So I guess, to keep this on topic, what practical redline can one hope to get with a build like this, using the stock heads.

[Bownse]

Smokey Yunick

oops! wrong base engine type!

[Flycaster]

Originally Posted by Draco-REX

...Is it possible to rework the stock heads to get an 8K or 9K redline? And would this hurt DD ability?...

Re-working the heads for high revs is not a problem, it's getting the lower end to stay together: the jury is still out on anything above 8K except for an ocassional over-run, and good minds are working on this issue too. As for your second question, what do you mean by "ability?" And, if you meant to say "reliability", the answer is pretty obvious.

An 8K+ rpm EJ257 should rightly be considered a full-on racing motor, and that means regularly scheduled tear-downs and rebuilds. That's not the type of powerplant you want in a true "daily driver." Sure, it's seductive, but it is the wrong tool for the job.

[Neanderthal Racing]

Originally Posted by Draco-REX

You've done a crapload of research. Is it possible to rework the stock heads to get an 8K or 9K redline? And would this hurt DD ability?

8k is one thing; 9k is another. i am expecting at least an 8k redline with our current setup, i.e., upgraded springs and retainers, a cleanup on the stock heads with a stg1 p&p. add a set of stg3 kelford/cosworth cams.

Originally Posted by Draco-REX

The only issue I see is having a Turbo that can feed a 9K redline, and that might mean a big, laggy snail.

exactly. a big (gt35r & up) turbo, headwork and cams all move the power band to the right at the sacrifice of low end power. how much of a sacrifice depends on how smart (or dumb) you are. personally, i believe the so-called lag issue has been way overdone as a topic of conversation. if you know how to use the gearbox to keep you in the motor's sweet spot, you can mitigate lag to some extent. at some point, and everyone can decide for yourselves exactly where that point is, the powerband is so far to the right it becomes a pita as a dd. subjectively, that hasn't happened yet for me, but then again, i didn't overdo the headwork (isfh).

[Draco-REX]

Originally Posted by Flycaster

Re-working the heads for high revs is not a problem, it's getting the lower end to stay together: the jury is still out on anything above 8K except for an ocassional over-run, and good minds are working on this issue too. As for your second question, what do you mean by "ability?" And, if you meant to say "reliability", the answer is pretty obvious.

An 8K+ rpm EJ257 should rightly be considered a full-on racing motor, and that means regularly scheduled tear-downs and rebuilds. That's not the type of powerplant you want in a true "daily driver." Sure, it's seductive, but it is the wrong tool for the job.

Ok, so if the OP or I wanted to get an 8K redline, it's possible with the stock heads. As for the "bottom end" or shortblock, the OP started the thread with a built shortblock as part of the build. So that should be 8K worthy if that is where the heads are going. I was just curious because I've seen some really high relines advertised for blocks and heads. Some as high as 10.5K.

I did mean ability. I wasn't sure if the stronger springs neccesary for the high redline would interfere with the engine's low end. If not, then I don't think there would be a negative influence on streetability. As long as compression is maintianed in the build, then off-boost power shouldn't suffer. When driving around town, I'm usually staying off boost. The engine has enough power to drive well enough.

As for reliability, I agree that a highly strung engine does require more TLC, but as a DD, it's not likely you'll be revving it out to redline all the time.

I'm just curious because down the road, maybe in a couple years or so, I may consider a similar route as the OP's. In that case, something that would drive well enough on the streets but scream on the track would would be my intention.

[Draco-REX]

Originally Posted by Neanderthal Racing

8k is one thing; 9k is another. i am expecting at least an 8k redline with our current setup, i.e., upgraded springs and retainers, a cleanup on the stock heads with a stg1 p&p. add a set of stg3 kelford/cosworth cams.

*nods* So 8K is a reasonable limit for the stock heads. I have to admit though, a screaming 9K redline would be impressive. But that would take a huge turbo.

exactly. a big (gt35r & up) turbo, headwork and cams all move the power band to the right at the sacrifice of low end power. how much of a sacrifice depends on how smart (or dumb) you are. personally, i believe the so-called lag issue has been way overdone as a topic of conversation. if you know how to use the gearbox to keep you in the motor's sweet spot, you can mitigate lag to some extent. at some point, and everyone can decide for yourselves exactly where that point is, the powerband is so far to the right it becomes a pita as a dd. subjectively, that hasn't happened yet for me, but then again, i didn't overdo the headwork (isfh).

Makes perfect sense. Driving around town with negative manifold pressure is perfectly fine. My only worry with a big snail is having the power come on unexpectedly. But that's more of a tune issue.

[Neanderthal Racing]

Originally Posted by Draco-REX

*nods* So 8K is a reasonable limit for the stock heads. I have to admit though, a screaming 9K redline would be impressive. But that would take a huge turbo.

more accurately, it would take a huge turbo to take full advantage of a 9k redline.

Originally Posted by Draco-REX

*Makes perfect sense. Driving around town with negative manifold pressure is perfectly fine. My only worry with a big snail is having the power come on unexpectedly.

there's nothing unexpected about it (isfh).