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IWSTI Addict since: Jun 2003 | 
Since we receive so many questions regarding brake pads, I thought that we should start a thread in which we can consolidate people's experiences.
The STi is a new car and its brakes are also new to the market that there isn't much historical and reliable information about what works and what does not. So, as a starter, I am posting some information from BMW and Porsche boards. Reader -When evaluating your needs, please keep in mind the owner's perspective, car (power and weight) and usage conditions. I will try to include that if that information is available. Also, please do not generalize a particular compound to the entire line of a brand name. Every pad model/compound has a purpose and if used in the wrong circumstances, it will perform unsatisfactorily. Contributors - If you would like to share your experiences, please include as objective data as possible, we are not in a contest to find the "best all-purpose" pad, that does not exist; trust me. There are compromises one way or another. Also, please post as detail information as possible, so we can be of some value to readers. I will update the table-like format accordingly.
Thank you. Quote: CARBOTECH
benaj, 1998 M3/, S4, Frequent Tracker
I moved on to carbotech's race pad. Interesting pad. Decent cold bite for a race pad (allows me to change pads at the house if I want to without *too* much drama on the roads. But don't take me wrong, this is not a pad I would want on the street when commuting). At the track, very good modulation but the torque is about 8/10's of the ferodos. Though I haven't been able to overstress the car ever with these pads, the more you ask, the more they give. They just don't suck the eyeballs out of your head hauling down from triple digit speeds like the ferodos did. The catcher for me about these pads is that I have done 10-12 track days on this set (front and rear) and I still have pad left for an event or two next spring!
quick96m3, '96 BMW M3, club racer
I've been running the Carbotech Panther XP's (front) with Hawk HP Plus (rear) for the past four track days and use a dedicated set of rotors for track. I've found the Panther XP's to be exceptional for wear (still have ~60-70% left) and have good, even bite, although not nearly as much bite as my previous (and discontinued) favorites, Hawk HT-8. My only complaint about the Panther XPs is I cannot for the life of me get the rotors bedded evenly - the pad material consistently forms a pattern on the rotor surface, resulting in pulsing/warped feel under hard braking, especially if any steering input is added. I contacted Carbotech about this and was told to resurface the rotors and take it easy on the first session, which I did, but it didn't help.
magnetic1, 2002 Corvette, E36 M3, hpde instructor, autoxer, carbotech dealer
Just got back from VIR and must say these Carbotech XP9s are absolutely amazing... everyone seems to have their own opinions on brake pads... but I don't think I'll be running any other pad BUT the Carbotechs from now on.
They are track only... they still work on the street.. I actually drove home on them from VIR because it got dark and I didn't have time to change them...
They do make a hell of a lot of noise though on the street...
| Quote: HAWK PERFORMANCE
Emre, '91 E30 318is, '90 E30 325iX, Frequent Tracker
When cold, the Hawk Blues are very hard on rotors, don't stop well, and chatter like crazy. But once they warm up after a couple of hard stops (usually takes less than half a lap) they're absolutely amazing! Incredible bite and fade resistance. They favor a very abrupt braking technique: mash them hard then let go. It's like hitting a brick wall! When used in this manner, they last forever. However, if you drag out your braking, they don't work very well or last very long.
The main problem with the Blues is that they're very difficult to modulate...they're pretty much a "stop switch" if you know what I mean. Also, the dust is very tenacious and incredibly corrosive. I've ruined a set of wheels and lost bits of paint on the car when I neglected to clean the dust off right away.
quick96m3, '96 BMW M3, club racer
The Hawk HP Plus's were purchased as a full set (F/R) when I was foolish enough to listen to people who said they worked great for both street and track use. Hella scary on track - pitiful stopping power. The only reason I'm still running them on the rear (on track only) is because I wanted to see how they worked with the Panther XPs up front. They still stink in the rear, it feels like I'm going to endo under hard braking. I keep hoping to get my front Panthers to bed right so I can justify buying the same compound for the rear. I'll have to decide on new rears within the next couple track days, as the HP Plus's are almost worn out.
| Quote: FEREDO
benaj, 1998 M3/, S4, Frequent Tracker
Once you get them hot, I really enjoyed the progressive modulation and extreme torque from a set of Ferodo DS3000s. They were a ***** to work with when cold. Needed at least 3 blocks of left foot braking to get them hot enough to stop on the street (sometimes I am lazy and want to change my pads before I head to the track on friday night). And especially with the trailer thought I was endangering other people on the expressway several times drivng home from the track on sunday. My main gripe with the pads is that they only lasted 4 1/2 track days. And the one rear pad blew out on me, going from a *measured* 1/4 depth left straight down to the backing plate in one run session. The other rear still was at its 1/4 depth-left when I got off the track, but that one side had disintegrated completely-- hopefully a fluke. Funny how much stopping power I still had with three ferodo-stopping wheels and one metal backing plated wheel!
lartymarf, a BMW, Occasional Tracker
[comments on DS2500]
1. Very linear feel all the way until ABS kicks in.
2. Pedal feel is a little numb, not as crisp as when I was running stock pads.
3. Noticeabley less intial bite when rotors/pads are cold. (Enough stopping power for daily street driving though.)
4. They require some heat into them to truely shine.
5. ABS kicks in sooner and ealier than before.
| Quote: PERFORMANCE FRICTION
DannO, BMW M Coupe, Frequent Tracker
Performance Friction 97s are the way to go for a track only pad on cars with ABS. The only downside is the dust - it's nasty stuff. If the dust (which there is a lot of) gets wet and isn't cleaned up it will chemically bond to your wheels when dry. It's a real biotch to get off then, though not impossible. I've clayed it off before, but have heard there is an oven cleaner out there that makes it easy to do. Haven't tried that yet...
I switch them out for PF z-rated pads for the street because the compounds are compatible, but I'm not very happy with the z pads. Too much pedal input is required. They produce ZERO dust though.
M3Balance, M3 3.2ltr, 328, Club Racer
the maximum (only race cars):
Performance Friction 83 are also the way to go for a track only pad on cars, you need one pad and one rotor togehter, easy to change.
Emre, '91 E30 318is, '90 E30 325iX, Frequent Tracker
As for the PF-90's, they're a whole different story. There's much less initial bite, but they're very easy to modulate. The dust is less corrosive and easy to clean. However, they don't have the stopping power or fade resistance of the Hawk Blues. They don't work very well with my braking style.
| Quote: Cobb Tuning
nathansvt
I like the feel of the cobb racing better, and because it never really gets cold here they bite enough for street use, esp with the porterfield in the back. I know I'll get more rotor wear with the cobb racing pads, but since the backing plates scored the rotor a little bit I'm planning a replacement soon anyway. Noise with the porterfields is non-existent. The cobbs squeal a little, but not enough to bother me.
| Quote: PORTERFIELD
traqrat, E30 325, Frequent Tracker
Porterfield R4 - excellent pedal feel, lots of initial bite, excellent torque, excellent fade resistance, lasted 4 track days, $$$
BONTRAK, E46 330i, moderate tracker
**Porterfield R4S Review**
Dust -- mild-to-moderate
Cold Bite/streetability -- Excellent
Track Bite/stopping power when hot -- good-to-very good
Track Fade resistance -- very good
Rotor wear -- very good (got nearly3 years out of front rotors!)
Pad life -- pretty short (between 3 and 5 Solo 1-type events)
Used them on all 4 wheels -- for track purposes I figure you don't want to leave braking power on the shelf becuase you couldn't bother to put a performance oriented, hi brake torque pad on the rear wheels.
For the guy who wants to drive his track pad on the street, the R4S is hard to beat!
biodan, 02 M3, Adv. Tracker
ust swapped in Porterfield R4 in the AP caliper. Not very dusty but leaves rotor deposits even with Bimmerworld backing plates and ducted cooling. Dust is not corrosive. I did the scotch-brite rotor scrubbing before swapping back to the Ferodo's. Slight squealing, much quieter than the Brakeman#3. The front R4 set was $240.
The R4 has linear torque and good stopping power- not bad when cold too. After a 2-day Sears DE about 10days ago in the advanced group, i only wore the pads down 1.5-2mm (granted Sears is not hard on brakes). At this rate, i should get more than 8 days out of the pad... on a 3230lb e46m3!! Odd that traqrat only got 4days :-)
seattimerules, '98 M3/4, '01 325iX, frequent tracker
1st thing I did before ever going to the track was full time brake ducting. After running some SHO's in the early 90's at NHIS (hard on brakes) I learned quick! Best safety tip I can offer all!
With that said my 1st set of miracle do it all pads were Porterfield R4S's. Great Auto X pad, and great track pad AS LONG AS THEY ARE DUCTED. These pads suck if you do not duct your front rotors...
Awesome Auto X pad, put sensitive to pedal stabbing.
Finally, after all this and now only driving the car to and from schools, and events I run the Poterfield R4's.
Because they are more rotor friendly when cold and have rattle clips I chose them over the PF's. Lots of dust and squeeling, who cares!
THey may not last as long as the PF's but they are much more street friendly than the PF's and with ducting hope to extend their useful life by 200+% up front
I bed all my pads by LFB. THese suckers still smoked for two Auto X's before settling in.....THey always smoke when new :-)
Love the sound and smell of these pads :-0
Great Auto X pad if you drag your brakes coming to the starting line. Still getting used to LFB with them..............
nathansvt, STi
I tried the R4S pads at a track day after having serious fade problems with the stock pads. The R4S pads were great on the street and VERY rotor-friendly. On the track, they outlasted the stock pads, but I still couldn't make a full 20-min session without fade. I then put on the Cobb racing pads. The difference between the cobb racing (not street) pad and the R4S is as great as the difference between R4S and stock. I'm currently running the Cobb racing on the street as well. They are a bit noisy, but I dont mind a bit of squeal now and then. I also don't encounter cold weather much and they seem to stop fine after a very short warmup. Cold, they dont stop as well as a stock STi setup, but still better than a stock WRX. The cobb racing pads DO incur noticeably greater rotor wear.
I put the Porterfield R4S pads on and drove about 300 miles to a track day. I ran 2 days on those pads on a medium-tight course. When I pulled the pads on the second day (forgot to change 'em until I felt griding) The rears were half gone and the fronts were down to the backing plates (ugh).
The rears had perfectly even wear, on each side of the caliper and on each side of the car. The passenger side front was also even wear, down the plates on both sides of the caliper. So I went over to the drivers side and the outboard pad was also on the backing plate. What strikes me as REALLY odd is that the driver side inboard pad still has about 1/4 to 1/3 of the pad left. I bled the caliper to see if it was due to a bubble, but I got clear fluid from both sides. Any thoughts on why this may be happening? I didn't notice any uneven wear when I pulled the factory pads off the first time, at about half-pad.
I would expect uneven wear (on the inboard side) with a floating caliper, but I thought our fixed calipers should reduce the tendency to wear one side more than the other.
I was happy with their performance but they wore more quickly than the stock pads, which was a bit of a surprise. I'm now running the R4S in the back and Cobb Racing up front.
tecnic1, STi?
torched a set of R4-s in 3 days @ VIR in my ITR. I was not impressed with those pads.
I found the ferrodo DS2500s to be much better street and track pads for a little less $.
| Quote: PAGID
Phantom, BMW 95 M3, Frequent Tracker
* Pagid Sport (Excellent pedal modulation and feedback. Very good fade resistance. Good brake torque. About mid-grade temperature resistance.)
# Pagid Standard (Very good pedal modulation and feedback. Lower fade resistance. Lower brake torque.)
M3Balance, M3 3.2ltr, 328, Club Racer
Pagid RS14, keramik, very stable breaking, high-grade temperature resistance, sometimes squiiizze.
traqrat, E30 325, Frequent Tracker
Pagid Orange - excellent pedal feel, good torque, excellent fade resistance, lasted 6 track days, $$$$
biodan, 02 M3, Adv. Tracker
Pagid Blue - a good street pad but not much stopping power. Rotor friendly and no fade. Dust was not corrosive. Took them off after wearing them down only half-way after 5 track days. I have the Bimmerworld backing-plates & ducted cooling to the rotors. About $200 for the front.
| Quote: MINTEX
Phantom, BMW 95 M3, Frequent Tracker
# Mintex (standard) (Good pedal feedback, slightly lower braking torque and less fade resistance, though)
| Quote: EBC
traqrat, E30 325, Frequent Tracker
EBC Redstuff - poor pedal feel (mushy), good torque, good face resistance, lasted 2 track days, $$$, would NOT recommend
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04-08-2004, 01:32 PM
