How is the 08 gearing?

HPH · 03-20-2008, 10:14 AM

One thing that annoyed me about my 05 STi -- something that I adapted to, but that was annoying -- was the setup of the gears. In essence, the "distance" between 4th and 5th was imbalanced relative to the other "shift distances." I'm wondering what that's like in the new 08 setup. Here's what I mean:

Suppose you're running through all of the gears quickly, so it's possible to ignore the loss of speed while shifting, and suppose you run the car up to 6500RPM in each gear (never mind red line issues). Here's a graph of where you'll be, RPM-wise, after you make each of the shifts, with three different gear setups plotted [I'm assuming that the gear ratios I found online at cars101.com are correct, except for the obvious typo for 5th for 08, which I corrected using the value from other places]:

In this picture, the red curve is my 05 STi; you can see that the first three shifts are predictable, but then the fourth shift, into 5th gear, results in an extra drop in RPMs. This is what I found to be annoying.

From the gear ratios for the new 08 STI, it looks to me as if Subaru has overcompensated for this issue -- the 08 gearing is the green curve. I guess that my question to 08 owners is: how does this feel to you? (Yeah, I could go drive one, but this is the sort of thing that it takes lots of miles, and pretty hard running through all six gears many times, to appreciate.)

For reference, I've also included the gearing for my 05 Honda S2000 in blue. The first time I drove this car (for which I traded my STi), I noticed this smoother set of transitions, and I've liked it ever since. I'm wondering how annoyed I'd wind up being with the new 08 STI gearing.

I'm not trying to start another bickering contest with this; I'm just curious about the new setup. And I wonder why Subaru has such trouble getting 5th gear right. Thanks, HPH

solovus · 03-20-2008, 10:26 AM

If you extrapolate between 4th and 6th you get a similar curve to your S2K...this is how my car feels because I almost always skip over 5th.

jph · 03-20-2008, 10:28 AM

the '08 has the same gearing as the '07

lower gears are taller (especially noticeable in 4th gear which now tops out way above 100mph). 5/6 are still exactly the same.

it feels more linear. it also "feels" slower. due to the taller gearing.

J.

waktasz · 03-20-2008, 11:02 AM

Fourth and fifth gear feel very close together now.

Subw00er · 03-20-2008, 11:07 AM

1st gear is WAY too short. Its almost a useless gear, but the sti doesnt really have enough torque to start in 2nd gear.. The shift between 1-2 is also very hard to get right because the revs hold. 1st gear should be much taller.

CFar · 03-20-2008, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Subw00er

1st gear is WAY too short. Its almost a useless gear, but the sti doesnt really have enough torque to start in 2nd gear.. The shift between 1-2 is also very hard to get right because the revs hold. 1st gear should be much taller.

I agree 1st is too short for true balls out performance, but its pretty good for the street. A compromise. However I disagree that the revs hang, if anything its the opposite for me.

As for the spacing, the gears are evenly distributed. My old 06 had the big jump from 4-5 and I agree it was a pain in the toocus.

jermdeez · 03-20-2008, 11:46 AM

1st is good, it's just hard to use. You either go to go full bore or not at all in it.......but it rips out of the hole, and if you can really shift fast theres no problem.......the sti can be shifted with almost no lag in between shifts so...........but I do see your point, say you are making a right turn onto a higher speed road from a stop and u go then end up punching it to late and u gotta shift incredibly fast.........It's hard for me to even shift first gear on race gas......its ridiculous.........................sti gearing is so short.......but I LOVE short gears......

on race gas my car is so fast I literally spend more time out of gear shifting 1-5 then I do in gear. Kinda silly i'll admit.

monk · 03-20-2008, 11:48 AM

first is short and stout... for a reason - standing start. you don't use 1st any other time in sport/motorsport driving. but yes, i wish it were taller, cause i don't launch this car.

the 07/08 4-5 upshift is stupid . it's a 500RPM difference as opposed to the typical 1K difference.

the nice thing? you can just drop in a legacy spec B 5th and 6th gear, then everything is linear.

i've found the 07 gearing to be a blast on the roadcourse. it may feel slower to some, but it actually runs faster than the previous years' gearing.

BuzSTid · 03-20-2008, 02:12 PM

it took me a while to figure out the 1-2 shift i always seemed to bugger it up til i treated it like i was trying to get the hole shot. much to my surprise the gear change was very much improved. it almost is like it needs to be hammered, only problem now is staying legal

**Digitalfiend** · 03-20-2008, 03:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Subw00er

1st gear is WAY too short. Its almost a useless gear, but the sti doesnt really have enough torque to start in 2nd gear.. The shift between 1-2 is also very hard to get right because the revs hold. 1st gear should be much taller.

I could start my '05 in 2nd if necessary, but what is the point? 1st gear is to get moving and, with AWD & TCS, there is no need to use 2nd for slippery surfaces. If they lengthen 1st, then they'll have to lengthen 2nd and that will make 2nd less usable for tight corners and possibly even require a downshift to 1st.

Quote:

Originally Posted by monk

i've found the 07 gearing to be a blast on the roadcourse. it may feel slower to some, but it actually runs faster than the previous years' gearing.

I've always wondered that. Technically, shorter gearing equals faster acceleration, but taller gears mean less shifting. I was amazed at how much time you can save by not having to downshift for a corner (i.e. saving an upshift after exiting.) This worked well in the '05 because I could stay in 3rd for a corner and power out. If you aren't beating on your gearbox (and what's the point for a lapping day), you could save about .4-.5 seconds on each corner. That adds up real fast.

My fear with the longer gearing is that tight technical tracks will require more downshifting because you don't have the short gearing that allows you to stay in a higher gear. Thoughts?

jermdeez · 03-20-2008, 05:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Digitalfiend

I could start my '05 in 2nd if necessary, but what is the point? 1st gear is to get moving and, with AWD & TCS, there is no need to use 2nd for slippery surfaces. If they lengthen 1st, then they'll have to lengthen 2nd and that will make 2nd less usable for tight corners and possibly even require a downshift to 1st.

I've always wondered that. Technically, shorter gearing equals faster acceleration, but taller gears mean less shifting. I was amazed at how much time you can save by not having to downshift for a corner (i.e. saving an upshift after exiting.) This worked well in the '05 because I could stay in 3rd for a corner and power out. If you aren't beating on your gearbox (and what's the point for a lapping day), you could save about .4-.5 seconds on each corner. That adds up real fast.

My fear with the longer gearing is that tight technical tracks will require more downshifting because you don't have the short gearing that allows you to stay in a higher gear. Thoughts?

As far as autox/tight canyons I definitely agree, if you had a stage. 2 05 damn...........I mean you don't even need to really be in the right gear LOL. So I guess those turns you could hit in 3rd will drop down to second, but those sortuv off corners where you don't want to be in second because its revving so high, but third isn't enough........well now you can stay in 2nd I guess. No matter what for me the issue is simple; I love the way the short gearing feels and the response it brings.......regardless...........def think short gearing of older ones is better for canyon stuff

STIVendetta · 03-20-2008, 05:23 PM

The longer gears~ FEEL~great! Staying in it "longer" without that time wasting shift.

**Digitalfiend** · 03-20-2008, 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jermdeez

I love the way the short gearing feels and the response it brings.......regardless...........def think short gearing of older ones is better for canyon stuff

Yeah I'm reserving final judgement until I get a couple track days under my belt with the new car. Around town though, I'm sure the new gearing is "easier" but the old gearing never bothered me. Some people complained that the short gearing was annoying in traffic - me, I said it gave me something to do.

Being able to floor it in 3rd and pull like it was in 2nd never gets old either.

So we'll see if I like the new (well, new for me) gearing...

Rootus · 03-20-2008, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by STIVendetta

The longer gears~ FEEL~great! Staying in it "longer" without that time wasting shift.

What is the point, then of having a six speed transmission? Bragging rights?

STIVendetta · 03-20-2008, 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rootus

What is the point, then of having a six speed transmission? Bragging rights?

Bragging rights? LOL Rootus....How about gas mileage...and shifting when I ~feel~ like it....just like Modding...using the extra power when one "feels" like it....

03-20-2008, 10:14 AM	#1
HPH STI Driver Location: EstesPark/BocaRaton Posts: 262 Join Date: May 2004 Trader Rating: (0)	How is the 08 gearing? One thing that annoyed me about my 05 STi -- something that I adapted to, but that was annoying -- was the setup of the gears. In essence, the "distance" between 4th and 5th was imbalanced relative to the other "shift distances." I'm wondering what that's like in the new 08 setup. Here's what I mean: Suppose you're running through all of the gears quickly, so it's possible to ignore the loss of speed while shifting, and suppose you run the car up to 6500RPM in each gear (never mind red line issues). Here's a graph of where you'll be, RPM-wise, after you make each of the shifts, with three different gear setups plotted [I'm assuming that the gear ratios I found online at cars101.com are correct, except for the obvious typo for 5th for 08, which I corrected using the value from other places]: In this picture, the red curve is my 05 STi; you can see that the first three shifts are predictable, but then the fourth shift, into 5th gear, results in an extra drop in RPMs. This is what I found to be annoying. From the gear ratios for the new 08 STI, it looks to me as if Subaru has overcompensated for this issue -- the 08 gearing is the green curve. I guess that my question to 08 owners is: how does this feel to you? (Yeah, I could go drive one, but this is the sort of thing that it takes lots of miles, and pretty hard running through all six gears many times, to appreciate.) For reference, I've also included the gearing for my 05 Honda S2000 in blue. The first time I drove this car (for which I traded my STi), I noticed this smoother set of transitions, and I've liked it ever since. I'm wondering how annoyed I'd wind up being with the new 08 STI gearing. I'm not trying to start another bickering contest with this; I'm just curious about the new setup. And I wonder why Subaru has such trouble getting 5th gear right. Thanks, HPH This ad is not endorsed by this member. Please register or login to hide this ad.

03-20-2008, 10:26 AM	#2
solovus The Next Petter Solberg Car: STIzzle Fav Mod: Tint Location: Toledo, OH Posts: 973 Join Date: Mar 2008 Trader Rating: (0)	Re: How is the 08 gearing? If you extrapolate between 4th and 6th you get a similar curve to your S2K...this is how my car feels because I almost always skip over 5th.

03-20-2008, 10:28 AM	#3
jph S204 Racer Car: '08 STi Location: San Jose, CA Posts: 2,690 Join Date: Apr 2004 Trader Rating: (9)	Re: How is the 08 gearing? the '08 has the same gearing as the '07 lower gears are taller (especially noticeable in 4th gear which now tops out way above 100mph). 5/6 are still exactly the same. it feels more linear. it also "feels" slower. due to the taller gearing. J.

03-20-2008, 11:02 AM	#4
waktasz Professional STI Racer Car: 08 STI Family Wagon Fav Mod: A new motor for this POS Location: Philly Posts: 717 Join Date: Jan 2006 Trader Rating: (0)	Re: How is the 08 gearing? Fourth and fifth gear feel very close together now.

03-20-2008, 11:07 AM	#5
Subw00er STI Driver Car: White/Gold '08 STi Fav Mod: Right foot Location: NY Posts: 271 Join Date: Feb 2008 Trader Rating: (0)	Re: How is the 08 gearing? 1st gear is WAY too short. Its almost a useless gear, but the sti doesnt really have enough torque to start in 2nd gear.. The shift between 1-2 is also very hard to get right because the revs hold. 1st gear should be much taller.

03-20-2008, 11:46 AM	#7
jermdeez Spec C Club Posts: 1,581 Join Date: Feb 2005 Trader Rating: (0)	Re: How is the 08 gearing? 1st is good, it's just hard to use. You either go to go full bore or not at all in it.......but it rips out of the hole, and if you can really shift fast theres no problem.......the sti can be shifted with almost no lag in between shifts so...........but I do see your point, say you are making a right turn onto a higher speed road from a stop and u go then end up punching it to late and u gotta shift incredibly fast.........It's hard for me to even shift first gear on race gas......its ridiculous.........................sti gearing is so short.......but I LOVE short gears...... on race gas my car is so fast I literally spend more time out of gear shifting 1-5 then I do in gear. Kinda silly i'll admit.

03-20-2008, 11:48 AM	#8
monk Junior STI Driver Car: 07 OBP STi Fav Mod: patience Location: GA Posts: 92 Join Date: Dec 2006 Trader Rating: (0)	Re: How is the 08 gearing? first is short and stout... for a reason - standing start. you don't use 1st any other time in sport/motorsport driving. but yes, i wish it were taller, cause i don't launch this car. the 07/08 4-5 upshift is stupid . it's a 500RPM difference as opposed to the typical 1K difference. the nice thing? you can just drop in a legacy spec B 5th and 6th gear, then everything is linear. i've found the 07 gearing to be a blast on the roadcourse. it may feel slower to some, but it actually runs faster than the previous years' gearing.

03-20-2008, 02:12 PM	#9
BuzSTid Junior STI Driver Car: 08 WRB STi Fav Mod: Stage 1 Location: Calgary Posts: 195 Join Date: Feb 2008 Trader Rating: (0)	Re: How is the 08 gearing? it took me a while to figure out the 1-2 shift i always seemed to bugger it up til i treated it like i was trying to get the hole shot. much to my surprise the gear change was very much improved. it almost is like it needs to be hammered, only problem now is staying legal

03-20-2008, 05:23 PM	#12
STIVendetta Spec C Club Car: << 07-STi >> Fav Mod: A Good Wax Job Location: NC- Kingdom of AWD Posts: 1,238 Join Date: May 2007 Trader Rating: (0)	Re: How is the 08 gearing? The longer gears~ FEEL~great! Staying in it "longer" without that time wasting shift.